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Tue Mar 10 15:51:24 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls: I use cyan on black bg. I find its the easiest on my eyes. 
Tue Mar 10 15:54:37 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: I use 'bright grey' or 'dark white' (whatever you wanna call it) on black as default, but (for me) tells are cyan, channels purple, exits yellow, and combat messages are colored based on damage dealt/taken. 
Tue Mar 10 15:55:05 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: from green to bright red :) 
Tue Mar 10 15:56:45 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: yellow text on a red background is quite pleasant 
Tue Mar 10 15:58:18 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls: is there really any good damage? 
Tue Mar 10 15:58:53 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls: red touches yellow, yer a dead fellow 
Tue Mar 10 16:00:18 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls: for you non-english speaking folks, thats the english saying to distinguish the poisonous coral snakes from the garden-variety corn snake. *pun intended* 
Tue Mar 10 16:19:11 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: corn snakes? 
Wed Mar 11 02:59:06 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: does anyone truly understand how to use the autotools? 
Wed Mar 11 02:59:55 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i'm going to have nightmares of being bludgeoned with Mafile.ins :( 
Wed Mar 11 03:00:15 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: Makefile.in 
Thu Mar 12 17:04:35 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: LOL HAI GUISE! 
Thu Mar 12 17:05:43 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls: i think it's too late for him. the Makefile.in has won. 
Thu Mar 12 17:06:03 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: there are alternatives to autotools... 
Fri Mar 13 14:00:31 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls: suppose you have a set of 100 related funs which call each other regularly. Is there any value to separating them into 2 files of 50 funs each and having file1 inherit file2? 
Fri Mar 13 14:01:02 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: don't think so. 
Fri Mar 13 14:01:21 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: inheritance either adds a very small verhead, or none at all. 
Fri Mar 13 14:02:11 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: now if you could split them in more files than that, it could be useful for simplyfying mainteance. 
Tue Mar 17 03:35:22 2009 [imud_code] Cozminsky@EotL: What's zmp? 
Tue Mar 17 03:35:44 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: heh. i was wondering that myself. one of these days i'll actually read that thread 
Tue Mar 17 03:35:57 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: sounds like a mud protocol that works as a meta-protocol 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:15 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: or like 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:23 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: what's that term from the OSI model? 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:25 2009 [imud_code] Cozminsky@EotL: well the thread was all about terminals and telnet, etc. 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:28 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: "carrier"? 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:37 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: cant remember now 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:41 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: "medium"? 
Tue Mar 17 03:36:54 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: i'm embarrassed i've forgotten so much of my formal CS schoolin 
Tue Mar 17 03:37:18 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: sloaris rots the brain 
Tue Mar 17 03:37:22 2009 [imud_code] Cozminsky@EotL: you mean the OSI network layers? 
Tue Mar 17 03:37:32 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: ooo lookit mr smarty 
Tue Mar 17 03:38:05 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: ah TRANSPORT 
Tue Mar 17 03:39:28 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: from the smarty talk in the thread, it sounds like zmp can be used to piggyback other stuff 
Tue Mar 17 03:39:35 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: it does sound interesting 
Tue Mar 17 03:39:41 2009 [imud_code] Cozminsky@EotL: aha http://zmp.sourcemud.org/ 
Tue Mar 17 03:39:48 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: zune mud protocol! 
Thu Mar 19 20:40:46 2009 [imud_code] Wodan@Discworld: guess you could send the MSSP PLAINTEXT in black on black 
Thu Mar 19 20:41:48 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: dunno about <esc>[2J , but ^H works in most mud clients... 
Thu Mar 19 20:42:07 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: so MSSP^H^H^H^H<sp><sp><sp><sp> might work 
Thu Mar 19 20:42:41 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: but black on black is prolly more idiotproof. 
Thu Mar 19 20:43:04 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: back in black 
Sat Mar 21 23:40:58 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Testing, testing.. 
Sat Mar 21 23:56:56 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: if not one told you Traveller, the test worked :) 
Sat Mar 21 23:57:39 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Yay, thanks 
Sat Mar 21 23:58:00 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: no prob. 
Sat Mar 21 23:58:55 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: Spirit World? sounds interesting 
Sun Mar 22 00:00:09 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Yeah, it's a heavy borrowing from shamanic mythos.  Bad things from the spiritual Outside have attacked the World Tree, leaving the players on a splinter still connected to the other worlds, but unconnected from the whole.  Totems instead of races, and different totems have different interpretations of each class. 
Sun Mar 22 00:02:05 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: cool... I like it... anyone with any knowledge of native american, druidic/Celtic religion or such should very much enjoy it :) 
Sun Mar 22 00:02:54 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: I'm trying to avoid making it too loyal to the source material, but it should be a lot of fun as an alternate-universe take.  Thanks! 
Sun Mar 22 00:06:00 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: what you going to use as source material for a base line? 
Sun Mar 22 00:07:32 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Primarily modern interpretations of native american stuff, some good old viking stuff, and a little Lovecraft for the Outsiders.  Some amount of random new-age stuff, probably, it's surprisingly hard to separate out :P 
Sun Mar 22 00:09:07 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: good mix of materials, should be a very well rounded game.  WereWolf: The Apocolypse by WhiteWolf Game Studios has some good totem shaman stuff too.  That was their baseline for the game as well. 
Sun Mar 22 00:10:07 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: I'm specifically avoiding ripping them off TOO much, although one class in particular is going to be hard to miss, the monk-equivalent essentially gets something like Crinos for whatever your totem is.  And I think even a deer in Crinos form would be scary as hell. 
Sun Mar 22 00:10:48 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: anything with a warform is freaky.. lucky Diablo2 helped with their expansion class :) 
Sun Mar 22 00:10:51 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: (If I can pull it off, later classes you can choose give an even bigger form, and possibly a rideable one, though I suspect player mounts is one of those impossible-to-pull-off-right things) 
Sun Mar 22 00:12:21 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World DS: This whole intermud thing is so weird to me, I haven't worked on a MUD since ROM back in the early 90s :P 
Sun Mar 22 00:12:36 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: yeah, but its cool :) 
Sun Mar 22 00:12:47 2009 [imud_code] Crash@Age of Mediocrity: It's the coolest thing since toasted bagels with butter, soy cheese, and fake salami. 
Sun Mar 22 00:13:03 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: why does that sound GOOD?  I don't understand! 
Sun Mar 22 00:13:36 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: I'm not sure how i'm going to envision the mounts thing myself.. but I have plans for them anyway 
Sun Mar 22 00:14:26 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: ds has mounts 
Sun Mar 22 00:14:37 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Ridable -players- though? 
Sun Mar 22 00:14:42 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: yeah 
Sun Mar 22 00:14:48 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: ...oh.  Awesome. 
Sun Mar 22 00:14:49 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls: not by default but it can be done 
Sun Mar 22 00:15:24 2009 [imud_code] Daius@MotD: yep DS sure does :) 
Sun Mar 22 00:17:19 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: Okay, I think I'm sticking with DS 
Sun Mar 22 00:19:59 2009 [imud_code] Crash@Age of Mediocrity: Well, certianly don't go back to ROM. 
Sun Mar 22 00:21:38 2009 [imud_code] Traveller@Spirit World: I've got what I think is a fun combat idea.  Each round, you generate a number of possible moves based on your weapon...slashes, pommel hits, etc., a number based on your skills, and rolls hit and damage on them immediately.  Then it picks the best one(s), based on preferences (so you can say, prefer piercing damage as though it was worth twice as much).  So a skilled fighter can see more openings and choose the best one. 
Sun Mar 22 04:41:28 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls: does anyone know of any good materials describing memory allocation strategies for small objects/structs in C/C++? 
Tue Mar 24 19:49:44 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: so, if a call to fread() both exactly fills the input buffer and exhausts the data in the file, does it set feof()?  e.g. reading 5 bytes from a 5 byte file into a 5 byte buffer. 
Tue Mar 24 19:50:35 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: ... isn't the C standard to set feof only after you bump from the end the second time? 
Tue Mar 24 19:50:50 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: that's what i'm trying to find... 
Tue Mar 24 19:50:58 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: google is too cluttered these days 
Tue Mar 24 19:56:10 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: libc.info says "If `fread' encounters end of file in the middle of an object, it returns the number of complete objects read, and discards the partial object.  Therefore, the stream remains at the actual end of the file." 
Tue Mar 24 19:57:08 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: but what if the last record is complete... 
Tue Mar 24 19:57:25 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: yep, it's the edge cases that always cut ya ;) 
Tue Mar 24 20:01:14 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: tested. 
Tue Mar 24 20:01:27 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: after reading last record feof is zero. 
Tue Mar 24 20:01:39 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: next try, fread returns zer feof gets set to 1. 
Tue Mar 24 20:02:26 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: so, it sets feof only after it bounced from the end, not when it read the alst char before it. 
Tue Mar 24 20:03:54 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: (on linux/glibc , that is ;) 
Tue Mar 24 20:10:40 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: Yep, repeateble. Bottom line, if fread() returned same number as you passed in param 3 feof is zero, if it returned less feof is 1, if it returned more the world is coming to an end. 
Tue Mar 24 20:49:29 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: heh, thanks :) i guess that edge case is only deserving of a comment, not a fix :) 
Tue Mar 24 20:50:51 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: what "fix"? it's a standard behavior... 
Tue Mar 24 20:51:34 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: you'vre read three, sevven, X records. So, the last character was read succesfully. 
Tue Mar 24 20:51:54 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: you don't give a **** that there is no more chars. 
Tue Mar 24 20:52:12 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: next time you try to read something, you find out there's no more stuff. 
Tue Mar 24 20:52:27 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: so you pull the feof flag on th eflagpole. 
Tue Mar 24 20:52:37 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: but if i'm tring to read in the max size in one block and it exactly fits that the buffer is the same size as the file, i don't want to have to do an extra read just to see if it's eof :) 
Tue Mar 24 20:53:25 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: but see... code is ordered to take ten items, so it takes ten items. i doesn't automatically look into the box to see if it's empty now. 
Tue Mar 24 20:54:01 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls: that's prolly defined in ANSI C... or posix. 
Tue Mar 24 20:54:20 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: right, there's nothing wrong with fread() 
Tue Mar 24 20:54:40 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: but i don't want to introduce complexity in my code for a single byte 
Tue Mar 24 20:58:35 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: nvm, i found another way to deal with it :) 
Wed Mar 25 04:34:38 2009 [imud_code] Marajin@AndroDGD: Test? 
Wed Mar 25 04:34:57 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls: received. 
Wed Mar 25 04:35:02 2009 [imud_code] Marajin@AndroDGD: schweet 
Wed Mar 25 04:35:16 2009 [imud_code] Marajin@AndroDGD: want to migrate here then peeps? 
Thu Mar 26 02:25:42 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: which execution round do call_outs() with a 0 time execute in?  current or at the start of the next? 
Thu Mar 26 02:25:52 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: don't make me look at the fluff code :( 
Thu Mar 26 02:26:55 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Arcania: shouldnt it be the current one? if 0 means its executed when time=now 
Thu Mar 26 02:27:18 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Arcania: time()=now 
Thu Mar 26 02:37:35 2009 [imud_code] Sinistrad@Dead Souls: You're alive! 
Thu Mar 26 02:50:32 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i was thinking the same of you! 
Thu Mar 26 21:44:23 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: if you need to have a secure channel between two peers on a TCP/IP network, is SSL/TLS the best/easiest (meaning most supported) method?  And can you do that with peer-exchanged self-signed certs? 
Thu Mar 26 21:54:44 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: depends on your needs really. 
Thu Mar 26 21:56:39 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: tunneling over ssh, tls/ssl, ipsec and quite a few variations may all qualify as 'easiest' depending on what you have available and what you need. re: self signed certificates, yes as long as you have a secure (meaning, can't be tampered with) way to exchange them 
Thu Mar 26 22:05:12 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: when you connect a Windows Mobile device to the desktop, our desktop application opens a socket to the device and uses that for all it's RPC work.  In the old days we only supported USB cable and the physicality of that meant not needing extra security... but in today's world of wireless communications that stuff needs the extra security.  So I'm looking into a way to just secure the pipe without having to change the code on either side using standard (read: available in both the desktop and evice OS) APIs to accomplish this. 
Thu Mar 26 22:05:26 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: both sides have a cert store and a secure cred store 
Thu Mar 26 22:05:53 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: stunnel might be your friend then. 
Thu Mar 26 22:06:07 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: is that ssh? 
Thu Mar 26 22:06:12 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: no. 
Thu Mar 26 22:06:18 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: google it :) 
Thu Mar 26 22:06:38 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: google?  what is this 'google'? ;) 
Thu Mar 26 22:06:57 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: its your big brother :) 
Thu Mar 26 22:07:44 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: ahh, that does sound like what i'm asking for doesn't it?  Thanks for the pointer! 
Thu Mar 26 22:08:05 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@Way of the Force: :) 
Fri Mar 27 18:49:44 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls: by the time 7068 was leaked this morning their already on ~7075 
Fri Mar 27 18:50:03 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls: mischan.... 
Fri Mar 27 19:35:10 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls: intergossip appeared before his name 
Fri Mar 27 19:35:15 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls: meh mischan 
Tue Mar 31 14:05:58 2009 [imud_code] Feldegast@Testi: test :) 
Tue Mar 31 14:06:05 2009 [imud_code] Mordain@WarlordsDevDS1: success 
Tue Mar 31 14:06:21 2009 [imud_code] Feldegast@Testi: i am victorious! 
Tue Mar 31 14:07:33 2009 [imud_code] Womble@Anarres II: Huzzah! 
Wed Apr  1 05:00:18 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls Dev: advertising it all over the news like it's the Y2k bug 
Wed Apr  1 05:00:23 2009 [imud_code] Fizban@Dead Souls Dev: meh mischan 
Thu Apr  2 17:43:21 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: any function programmers out there? 
Thu Apr  2 17:43:32 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: functional? 
Thu Apr  2 17:43:47 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah functional sorry :P 
Thu Apr  2 17:43:51 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@GurbaHub: programmers are non functional by definition! 
Thu Apr  2 17:44:00 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Ocaml, SML, partially Lisp, hashell, F# that stuff... 
Thu Apr  2 17:44:02 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: hey, i thought you were eating! 
Thu Apr  2 17:44:12 2009 [imud_code] Aidil@GurbaHub: going to :) 
Thu Apr  2 17:44:14 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: he eats i3 logs. 
Thu Apr  2 17:44:16 2009 [imud_code] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: (i'm not using these) 
Fri Apr  3 09:20:10 2009 [imud_code] Womble@Anarres II: why partially lisp? 
Mon Apr  6 10:41:53 2009 [imud_code] Frog@Dreamverse: *peep* 
Mon Apr  6 14:57:43 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm resetting all lpmuds.net intermud routers. you may have to manually reconnect 
Fri Apr 10 16:11:13 2009 [imud_code] Cyix@Oyster Bay: bar 
Fri Apr 10 16:11:26 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: roseanne 
Sun Apr 26 03:49:50 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: test 
Sun Apr 26 03:50:43 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yep 
Tue May  5 06:41:42 2009 [imud_code] Zolvranzix@The New Horizon: anyone? 
Tue May  5 06:43:31 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hey anyone there? 
Tue May  5 06:53:09 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: hello 
Tue May  5 06:55:09 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hie 
Tue May  5 06:55:43 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hey deklax 
Tue May  5 06:55:54 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: do u have any idea how to update the mudlist? 
Tue May  5 06:56:16 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: hmmm 
Tue May  5 06:56:46 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: coz my list is like a gazillion years old 
Tue May  5 06:57:00 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: I am actually not sure 
Tue May  5 06:57:11 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: but... If you have my mud it has already been updated =P 
Tue May  5 06:57:42 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: oh. 
Tue May  5 06:57:49 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: are we on ur list? 
Tue May  5 06:58:10 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: yep 
Tue May  5 06:58:59 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: coz I can't see u on my list 
Tue May  5 06:59:07 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: awww :( 
Tue May  5 06:59:38 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: ohs wells 
Tue May  5 07:00:05 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: thks anyway 
Tue May  5 07:00:33 2009 [imud_code] Deklax@Evolution: you using Nightmare IV? 
Tue May  5 07:00:41 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: yea 
Tue May  5 17:17:10 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hi, anyone has any ideas how to update mudlist? 
Tue May  5 17:17:25 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: delete the intermud daemon's .o file then update it 
Tue May  5 17:17:34 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you're using nm4 right? 
Tue May  5 17:17:40 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: there's a bug in your intermud daemon 
Tue May  5 17:17:47 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lemme see if i remember the fix 
Tue May  5 17:17:58 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: when i do that, i get nothing on my mudlist 
Tue May  5 17:18:02 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: two dead chickens waved over the server 12 times 
Tue May  5 17:18:17 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: cool hope that works 
Tue May  5 17:21:17 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: meh, i dont remember now. it's a one line fix. returns for no good reason, cutting off the mudlist. see intermud.c in the updated nm4 download http://lpmuds.net/downloads.html 
Tue May  5 17:22:04 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: thks cratylus 
Tue May  5 17:22:44 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: np 
Tue May  5 17:53:44 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: cratylus 
Tue May  5 17:54:02 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that's me! 
Tue May  5 17:54:20 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: please, no swearing on public channels. 
Tue May  5 17:54:26 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hey! how come i managed to get it updated but i only get 10 on my list 
Tue May  5 17:54:40 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: and dead souls dev is not on it! 
Tue May  5 17:55:03 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: 'cratylus' is a swear word now? 
Tue May  5 17:55:14 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: dont make me fine you, K. 
Tue May  5 17:55:18 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: sorry :( 
Tue May  5 17:55:22 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: lol! 
Tue May  5 17:55:50 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: any ideas? 
Tue May  5 17:56:23 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: nm is hosed in any number of ways, man. just use the latest release of nm4 on the page 
Tue May  5 17:56:30 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: or do yourself a favor and use ds 
Tue May  5 17:56:33 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: or DS 
Tue May  5 17:56:40 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: or gurba! 
Tue May  5 17:57:38 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: can't really do that coz our codes are so heavily modified 
Tue May  5 17:58:21 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: blieve me, you got no idea 
Tue May  5 17:58:36 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: oh well! at least i got it update (slightly) 
Tue May  5 17:59:03 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: thks much 
Tue May  5 17:59:07 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: np 
Fri May  8 00:24:23 2009 [imud_code] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: cholinesterase inhibitor 
Fri May  8 19:16:15 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: anyone there? 
Fri May  8 19:16:21 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: hi 
Fri May  8 19:16:27 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: hi 
Fri May  8 19:16:41 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: can u do me a favour and see if u can log into my mud? 
Fri May  8 19:17:00 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: i've been having problems with ppl overseas logging in 
Fri May  8 19:17:16 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: please state the nature of the problem 
Fri May  8 19:17:37 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: just that ppl from outside singapore is not able to log into my mud 
Fri May  8 19:17:56 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: whilst ppl in singapore are logging in without problems 
Fri May  8 19:19:28 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: cratylus?? 
Fri May  8 19:19:58 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh hi 
Fri May  8 19:20:10 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sorry got sidetracked discussing someones social life 
Fri May  8 19:20:17 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: lol i noticed 
Fri May  8 19:20:24 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the mud is in singapore? 
Fri May  8 19:20:32 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: yearpz 
Fri May  8 19:20:47 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: your govt is prolly yer prob 
Fri May  8 19:20:54 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: lol 
Fri May  8 19:21:00 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: tell me about it 
Fri May  8 19:21:05 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sg is weirdly stalinist 
Fri May  8 19:21:13 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: not weirdly 
Fri May  8 19:21:15 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: theyre prolly blocking stuff theyre not familiar with 
Fri May  8 19:21:30 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: never had this problem for the longest time 
Fri May  8 19:21:41 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: ill try logging in hang on 
Fri May  8 19:21:58 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: galawin...maybe the problem is the people with problems are on a trunk line that's down. 
Fri May  8 19:22:13 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: ie, anyone can get in via one path, but not another? 
Fri May  8 19:22:17 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i connect fine actually 
Fri May  8 19:22:30 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: maybe the people with problems are noobs 
Fri May  8 19:22:35 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: isp's often hand-off traffic, peer swapping, but sometimes they squabble 
Fri May  8 19:22:37 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: ninja.. dun think so 
Fri May  8 19:22:50 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: 121.7.156.190 9999 works dandy for me 
Fri May  8 19:22:53 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: how do you know some people can't connect? 
Fri May  8 19:22:55 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: coz i checked with my isp 
Fri May  8 19:23:15 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: yeah, your isp may be okay, but another one might not be... 
Fri May  8 19:23:36 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: if you know people who can't, and know their ip addy, can you ping or traceroute them? 
Fri May  8 19:23:39 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: they've been bitching about not being able to log in via msn 
Fri May  8 19:23:51 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: can they log into other muds? 
Fri May  8 19:23:55 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: no problems pinging and tracing them 
Fri May  8 19:24:03 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: yeah 
Fri May  8 19:24:11 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: vista has telnet disabled by default 
Fri May  8 19:24:12 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: ok 
Fri May  8 19:24:16 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: i think i may have fixed it unknowingly 
Fri May  8 19:24:33 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: yay, wot u do? 
Fri May  8 19:24:53 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: by removing a port i opened 
Fri May  8 19:25:06 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: i think it was blocking something along the way 
Fri May  8 19:25:09 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: :) 
Fri May  8 19:25:14 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: cool 
Fri May  8 19:25:20 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sorry i dissed your government 
Fri May  8 19:25:24 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: technical term for that is 
Fri May  8 19:25:27 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im sure it's very nice, very clean 
Fri May  8 19:25:31 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: "pilot error". 
Fri May  8 19:25:33 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: nah 
Fri May  8 19:25:41 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: i agree with u wholeheartedly 
Fri May  8 19:25:47 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: :) 
Fri May  8 19:25:49 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: singapore...that the country that won't let people chew gum in public? 
Fri May  8 19:25:51 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: nice knowing you :( 
Fri May  8 19:25:58 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: thats the one! 
Fri May  8 19:26:08 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: ya know, we prolly could learn from them. 
Fri May  8 19:26:10 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: nice knowing u too craty 
Fri May  8 19:26:15 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: :) 
Fri May  8 19:26:31 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: btw omg welcome to 1997 with that lib 
Fri May  8 19:26:40 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: k, calling my buddy at NSA to let them know this was just a false alarm. 
Fri May  8 19:26:54 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: LOL! 
Fri May  8 19:26:56 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: heh...I can hear them laughing in the background. 
Fri May  8 19:27:09 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: 1997 
Fri May  8 19:27:23 2009 [imud_code] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: "Spaz, 1997" 
Fri May  8 19:39:35 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: test 
Fri May  8 19:39:40 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: ok passed 
Fri May  8 19:39:43 2009 [imud_code] Galawin@The New Horizon: :) 
Sat May  9 04:36:20 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Dead_Souls_demitris: hello? 
Sun May 10 04:24:50 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Please somebody say something. 
Sun May 10 04:25:53 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: i dont thing somebody is here today 
Sun May 10 04:26:07 2009 [imud_code] Avant@Dead_Souls_demitris: ? 
Sun May 10 04:27:04 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Cool. 
Sun May 10 04:27:15 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: I'm here. :) 
Sun May 10 04:27:40 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: So whats with the Dead_Souls_whatever ? 
Sun May 10 04:27:42 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: But, obviously looking at a different monitor. *ahem* 
Sun May 10 04:27:47 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: how many 100's of games are called deal souls 
Sun May 10 04:28:09 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Dead_Souls_demitris: our one shows as consua right? 
Sun May 10 04:28:34 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: Demitris@Dead_Souls_demitris 
Sun May 10 04:28:39 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: Yeah, I should change that..  I will change it today.  Yours also shows as Dead_Souls_demitris 
Sun May 10 04:28:41 2009 [imud_code] Mel@Dead_Souls_demitris: yay 
Sun May 10 04:28:51 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Sounds like a skin disease... 
Sun May 10 04:28:56 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: Until you use the admintool command 
Sun May 10 04:29:00 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: once upon a time you people would have been flayed alive for talking about something other than 400-level computer science topics 
Sun May 10 04:29:06 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: deal skin dermititus 
Sun May 10 04:29:20 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Dead_Souls_demitris: lol 
Sun May 10 04:29:27 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: Aren't MUDs in that category? 
Sun May 10 04:29:33 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Its kind of code related... 
Sun May 10 04:29:40 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: Crat no ii did not 
Sun May 10 04:29:56 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: for randome chat, imud_gossip (aka intergossip) is the standard 
Sun May 10 04:29:59 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: i guess its time i sent you all my shit 
Sun May 10 04:30:09 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Nazi! *ducks* 
Sun May 10 04:30:17 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: Oh, then what is cre? 
Sun May 10 04:30:27 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: cre is a local channel 
Sun May 10 04:30:29 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev leaves to start a new router. 
Sun May 10 04:30:37 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i cant see what you type on cre 
Sun May 10 04:31:03 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: Riiight.  So, then how are we having this conversation? lol 
Sun May 10 04:31:20 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you're using intercre right now, not cre 
Sun May 10 04:31:48 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: imud_code? 
Sun May 10 04:31:54 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: correct 
Sun May 10 04:32:01 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: aka intercre 
Sun May 10 04:32:03 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Is there a standard aliasing system? 
Sun May 10 04:32:20 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no, just tradition. imud_gossip is also known as igossip or intergossip 
Sun May 10 04:32:33 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: imud_code is known as icode or intercre 
Sun May 10 04:32:52 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: one of those things you dont know unless someone tells you or youve been around forever 
Sun May 10 04:33:02 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: A field with channel description and another with a suggested colour pair would be good... 
Sun May 10 04:33:31 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yes it would. in the meantime there's http://lpmuds.net/intermud.html 
Sun May 10 04:33:46 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: So... something that bugs me... how is it possible to tell if something disappears from chanlist or mudlist? 
Sun May 10 04:34:03 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: your mud gets a chanlist update 
Sun May 10 04:34:08 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: monitor it 
Sun May 10 04:34:12 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: It seems you rely on getting a 0 packet from the router... 
Sun May 10 04:34:20 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: But what if you miss that packet? 
Sun May 10 04:35:23 2009 [imud_code] Tim@TimMUD: whenever you get the packet, there's a sequence number that you get along with the packet, and if you log on and give an old sequence number, then the router will tell you the updates again 
Sun May 10 04:35:25 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I mean... suppose my mud goes down and when it comes back up its saved mudlist is out of synch with the router... 
Sun May 10 04:36:44 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: So the router stores a complete history? Back to 0? 
Sun May 10 04:37:02 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I also don't understand why mudlist is sent as multiple packets. Maybe I misread the spec. 
Sun May 10 04:37:12 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: i have asked davion to supply me with his data so that i can varify it, he will show anything, so i have to assume they have nothing or its fake,  
Sun May 10 04:37:20 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: wrong channel, fury 
Sun May 10 04:37:22 2009 [imud_code] Fury@OrientalDojo: show nothing 
Sun May 10 04:38:17 2009 [imud_code] Avant@Dead_Souls_demitris: yall talk to much 
Sun May 10 04:38:21 2009 [imud_code] Avant@Dead_Souls_demitris: hhe 
Sun May 10 04:38:37 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Oh dear. Sounds like dawn... Time to stop talking :-P 
Sun May 10 04:39:16 2009 [imud_code] Tim@TimMUD: I don't know if Cratylus changed it (this is running a modified version that started from a server I made), but the way I did it, the server has a list of deleted channels and numbers matching them, and it remembers the number that it used when it announced the channel was deleted, so when you log on giving an old number, it'll re-tell your MUD about the new updates to the list that are more recent than the number you gave... and you can just give 0 as a number if you want to re-get all the updates 
Sun May 10 04:39:39 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah i totally disregarded that stuff sry 
Sun May 10 04:40:00 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it comes in packets because the server is written in lpc and there are evaluation costs to manage 
Sun May 10 04:40:10 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Maybe I'll just send out 0 every now and again. 
Sun May 10 04:40:20 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: one big long connection for a full update would hose things up 
Sun May 10 04:40:24 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: But a single mud per packet? 
Sun May 10 04:40:33 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: naw you should get more than one 
Sun May 10 04:40:48 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: how many muds do you see in your list? 
Sun May 10 04:41:19 2009 [imud_code] Tim@TimMUD: when you log on, you get all of them like 10 at a time in like 10 or 20 parts, the single mud packets are updates that are happening right now, such as muds going down or reconnecting 
Sun May 10 04:41:30 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: 190 total. 
Sun May 10 04:41:49 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Dead_Souls_kejope: I only show 103. :P 
Sun May 10 04:42:01 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: 103 here too 
Sun May 10 04:42:11 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you're listing dosconnected muds prolly 
Sun May 10 04:42:16 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Well a lot are marked Down. 
Sun May 10 04:42:37 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I listed them all so I could use pretty colours. :-) 
Sun May 10 04:43:58 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so much drama, sorry for my lagged responses 
Sun May 10 04:44:25 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: anyway, i hate to say this, but my guess is that 90% of any problem you're having stems from a hosed/ancient client 
Sun May 10 04:44:33 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev ponders doing channel-add just to create [drama] 
Sun May 10 04:44:54 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: looking at what your mud reports as, i have difficulty feeling confidence in the solidity of your implementation 
Sun May 10 04:45:00 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I don't have a problem. 
Sun May 10 04:45:06 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: k 
Sun May 10 04:45:15 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I am just curious about the spec. 
Sun May 10 04:46:37 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: What do you mean 'mud reports as'? 
Sun May 10 04:47:57 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: your startup packet 
Sun May 10 04:48:23 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: "Nightmare/ShadowLib" 
Sun May 10 04:48:25 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Oh. What is wrong with it? 
Sun May 10 04:48:36 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: nm3 had poop for an i3 client 
Sun May 10 04:48:49 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: nm4 had some...problems 
Sun May 10 04:48:51 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Ah. No. I ended up starting from scratch. 
Sun May 10 04:49:33 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Hence that locate which I won't have responded to... good grief... shadowmudcolony? 
Sun May 10 06:24:35 2009 [imud_code] Mel@Dead_Souls_demitris: how do i connect 2 rooms that are already in exsistance? 
Mon May 11 01:05:09 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: 'I3P_ERROR_ERRORMESSAGE = "Your mud wasn't listening to blah, so I'll start you listening right now."' -- yet it doesn't seem to actually auto-listen. 
Mon May 11 01:06:02 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Obviously I need to send the listen, but it does seem like the router doesn't do what it says in that message. 
Mon May 11 01:51:16 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Did I break anybody elses channel list? 
Mon May 11 01:52:13 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm pretty sure the router does indeed add you to its listen list for the channel 
Mon May 11 01:52:49 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Yeah, somehow the router has the channel type I created as ({}) 
Mon May 11 01:53:02 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Which I suspect is why things started breaking. 
Mon May 11 01:53:19 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lolerz 
Mon May 11 01:53:57 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you, sir, are too much 
Mon May 11 01:54:07 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'll peek at the router 
Mon May 11 01:54:56 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I strongly suspect it was a bad packet I sent that did it. 
Mon May 11 01:56:03 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well i'm not seeing a problem 
Mon May 11 01:56:13 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: maybe it's just you having a problem? 
Mon May 11 01:56:21 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: what are the symptoms, exactly? 
Mon May 11 02:00:31 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Well... I suspect what happened is I sent a malformed channel-add. Somehow it looks like the router then got ({}) in my chanlist field. I'll play a little more and see 
Mon May 11 02:00:47 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: which channel? 
Mon May 11 02:01:39 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Not sure. Something like blah. xblah perhaps? I deleted my chanlist and I don't seem to be getting a new one now though. 
Mon May 11 02:02:18 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: reset your client, you'll get a new chanlist 
Mon May 11 02:02:31 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: or send a chanlist-req, i think i added support for that 
Mon May 11 02:03:33 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Yes... so... the chanlist looks like this:  "elephant_link" : ({ "Elephant", 1 }), "xblah" : ({ "shadowmuddevdev", ({ }) }) 
Mon May 11 02:03:55 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: teehee 
Mon May 11 02:03:57 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: thats the raw incoming chanlist-reply 
Mon May 11 02:04:09 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lemme see if that happens for me 
Mon May 11 02:06:00 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: bad news is i confirm you added a broken channel 
Mon May 11 02:06:09 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: good news is my client doesnt break from it :) 
Mon May 11 02:12:33 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Okay... I'm really convinced the channel-add I'm sending is correct. 
Mon May 11 02:13:01 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Is this current: http://wunderland.mud.de/mud/doc/misc/intermud3.html#channel-add 
Mon May 11 02:15:55 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sry i'm not looking at your packets right now. adding code to the router so people dont break themselves this way again 
Mon May 11 02:33:25 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Okay. Well, for the record tshark says I'm sending: ({"channel-add",5,"shadowmuddevdev",0,0,0,"mychannel4",0,}) 
Mon May 11 02:35:03 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: pretty sure you need a *i4 in there somewhere 
Mon May 11 02:42:07 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Yeah, sorry, I was trying to strip it down. 
Mon May 11 03:37:58 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: allrighty. the router should now reject invalid channel types, and periodically clean em up 
Mon May 11 03:38:04 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: thx for the bugrep 
Mon May 11 14:15:04 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: can anyone tell me how to add color to the welcome page? 
Mon May 11 14:23:25 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: anyone alive out there? 
Mon May 11 14:26:18 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev chokes and dies 
Mon May 11 14:26:25 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not anymore. 
Mon May 11 14:26:43 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: hey, you know how to add color to the welcome page? 
Mon May 11 14:29:47 2009 [imud_code] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: actually i have never tried it. (I assume you mean dead souls) 
Mon May 11 14:30:13 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: yeah it's for dead souls 
Mon May 11 14:31:21 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: i don't know how dead souls does it, but the term type won't be known at the point of printing out the welcome screen if it's stored per user 
Mon May 11 14:31:42 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: yeah I figured that was the problem 
Mon May 11 14:32:07 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: i've seen color in the welcome screen on a dead souls mud before though so it can be done 
Mon May 11 14:32:25 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: it may just have ANSI colour codes in the welcome screen 
Mon May 11 14:32:32 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: which would be unfriendly to dumb clients 
Mon May 11 14:32:41 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: you might not care though 
Mon May 11 14:32:53 2009 [imud_code] Lyeith@The New Horizon: well.. most clients now are ansi color friendly =p even those that don't support them just strip colors 
Mon May 11 14:33:07 2009 [imud_code] Lyeith@The New Horizon: so it might be alright to just throw ansi color in 
Mon May 11 14:33:11 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: actually, the terminal_type apply is called as soon as it's negotiated by telnet, so if you get displaying the screen on that, you can be sure it's safe 
Mon May 11 14:33:27 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: ok, i'm going to look up ansi codes 
Mon May 11 14:33:30 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: BUT, if the client doesn't support it, you'd never get the apply, so you'll need a timeout 
Mon May 11 14:35:00 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: no luck 
Mon May 11 14:35:21 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: I just get [31m appearing 
Mon May 11 14:35:46 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: I wonder how it's done in nightmare 
Mon May 11 14:49:47 2009 [imud_code] Tim@TimMUD: there's some stuff you can do to automatically detect if a client supports certain stuff, but I think most MUDs allow you to override that with your personal character's data, and thus most MUDs don't bother to do the detection stuff at initial connect, but I'm mostly guessing at that 
Mon May 11 14:52:43 2009 [imud_code] Andrew@Nanvaent: After you know a terminal type you can use more features, but you want to be careful about using the ones that have been around the longest since more clients will support them 
Mon May 11 14:54:36 2009 [imud_code] Tim@TimMUD: so I'm totally guessing at this, but I'm thinking Dead Souls probably prints the login screen before doing any terminal type stuff, and I think you have to do some amount of terminal type stuff ("Hi there, I'm about to to be sending you colors") before a client will even recognize color codes as being color codes 
Mon May 11 14:55:44 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: ok thanks for the answers 
Mon May 11 14:56:42 2009 [imud_code] Andrew@Nanvaent: I know on here, that it waits a second or two and if terminal_type() isn't called it assumes dumb otherwise it uses some colours based on the type provided (if it's supported internally) 
Mon May 11 14:58:35 2009 [imud_code] Andrew@Nanvaent: The other thing you could do is draw a dumb screen and if terminal_type() is sent while they are still logging on redraw over the top if the term type supports character positioning 
Mon May 11 14:59:15 2009 [imud_code] Andrew@Nanvaent: Although you do have to remember to restore the cursor position after that iirc 
Mon May 11 15:01:27 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: alright i'll look into it 
Mon May 11 18:37:59 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: does mc code compile on vanilla cygwin or do i ned to buy a commerdial ide? 
Mon May 11 18:38:02 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: mischan 
Mon May 11 18:44:05 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: mc? 
Mon May 11 18:44:15 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: mushclient 
Mon May 11 18:44:30 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: wtf? use telnet 
Mon May 11 18:44:38 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no kidn 
Mon May 11 18:44:58 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: thats kinda the point of me goin all nafey with character mode 
Mon May 11 18:45:03 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but i'm an open minded guy 
Mon May 11 18:45:26 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: but only open a crach 
Mon May 11 18:46:11 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: s/h/k 
Mon May 11 18:54:53 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: beats my old free zmud from 1993 tho 
Mon May 11 18:54:56 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: dangit 
Mon May 11 18:55:05 2009 [imud_code] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: put down the guiness 
Mon May 11 18:55:31 2009 [imud_code] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: v3.62. I still a copy of that somewhere. 
Mon May 11 18:55:56 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i have the free 32 bit one, before he decided to stop distributing it 
Mon May 11 20:32:51 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Cookie Dough: Cratylus, when you make a change such as when you added code regarding a broken channel yesterday, where could I find that? 
Mon May 11 20:35:02 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: http://dead-souls.net/RELEASE_NOTES 
Mon May 11 23:10:37 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: we use it 
Mon May 11 23:11:52 2009 [imud_code] Qwer@Archipelago: the naming scheme i chose can be seen in http://users.ecs.soton.ac.uk/dgc/xterm-256color.png 
Tue May 12 00:48:56 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Ahh, okay, that could be good. Thanks. 
Tue May 12 00:51:47 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I demand i3 rainbows. 
Tue May 12 00:54:22 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: HIRTHIYeHIGsHICtNOR 
Tue May 12 00:54:55 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Fail. :-P 
Tue May 12 00:55:12 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: What was that supposed to be? 
Tue May 12 00:55:14 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: Didn't go through I take it. :P 
Tue May 12 00:55:22 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: pinkfish code 
Tue May 12 00:55:33 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: What we use as ansi 
Tue May 12 00:55:38 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Cookie Dough: Very HIRTHIY! :) 
Tue May 12 00:55:49 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: HIR HIY HIG HIC NOR are not standard codes...? 
Tue May 12 00:56:17 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: They still work, but pinkfish passes better on this lib. 
Tue May 12 00:59:18 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: But they aren't normal pinkfish codes... Do you have any documentation on them? 
Tue May 12 01:00:14 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: Hmm... documentation has been rather poor as of late, so I doubt it. 
Tue May 12 01:01:09 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Is there a single mud that hasn't extended the pinkfish codes in their own strange way? :-) 
Tue May 12 01:01:12 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: Most of our documentation still refers to ansi and vt100 escape codes. :P 
Tue May 12 01:02:44 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: I personally use pinkfish instead of old ansi code because I then don't have to check for ansi_users() 
Tue May 12 01:03:15 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: You actually have ansi on your mud? Interesting. 
Tue May 12 01:03:52 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: We have some raw ansi on the login screen because, well, people suck. But nothing apart from that. 
Tue May 12 01:04:39 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: I think we only use ansi for wizard login screens, by that point they shouldn't be retarded. 
Tue May 12 01:05:12 2009 [imud_code] Wick@StarMUD: For the most part we haven't changed much of the ansi code in about 10 years. 
Tue May 12 01:18:06 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: some mud recently tried to use ansi colors in its name 
Tue May 12 01:18:22 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm still undecided as to whether to try to prevent that 
Tue May 12 01:18:28 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's kind of its own punishment, in a way 
Tue May 12 01:20:54 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Hmm. What about utf8? 
Tue May 12 01:24:59 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: naw i just ate. thx tho 
Tue May 12 01:25:49 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I don't get it... 
Tue May 12 01:31:51 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: I put color in the name of this mud and then found what you wrwote in the faq 
Tue May 12 01:32:14 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: :) 
Tue May 12 01:32:29 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua rtmfs. 
Tue May 12 01:33:25 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: every now and then a korean of chinese mud would show up 
Tue May 12 01:33:37 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: with totally garbled code for a name 
Tue May 12 01:33:42 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: havent seen that in a while tho 
Tue May 12 01:33:46 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: haha 
Tue May 12 01:33:57 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: *or 
Tue May 12 01:36:40 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: I can't get over how easy to use you've made this lib 
Tue May 12 01:36:55 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: :) 
Tue May 12 01:37:05 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: I just love QCS lol 
Tue May 12 01:40:37 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: how do I locate a file? 
Tue May 12 01:40:54 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Cookie Dough: find FILENAME 
Tue May 12 01:40:57 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: type: find nmsh 
Tue May 12 01:41:10 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: thanks 
Tue May 12 01:41:34 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: np. doesnt work on new files. the filelist is compiled every day 
Tue May 12 01:41:48 2009 [imud_code] Demitris@Consua: ah 
Tue May 12 01:41:59 2009 [imud_code] Kejope@Cookie Dough: No updatedb? :) 
Tue May 12 01:42:18 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: also doesnt traverse homedirs, for obvious security reasons 
Tue May 12 01:43:15 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you can reload the daemon if you need to refresh it, but exhaustive file ops like this are really not lpc's strong point 
Tue May 12 03:34:37 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: This router flooding detection seems a touch... touchy. 
Tue May 12 03:35:14 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: we've been hurt 
Tue May 12 03:36:25 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Still... Can you tell me from memory what the restriction is? 
Tue May 12 03:37:19 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sending the same packet within the same second is liable to kick it 
Tue May 12 03:37:29 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: That is lame. 
Tue May 12 03:37:45 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: how many times do you need to repeat the exact same packet in on second? 
Tue May 12 03:39:47 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Offhand I can't think of any, but I can think of lots of innocuous ways it could happen. 
Tue May 12 03:40:00 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: for example? 
Tue May 12 03:40:06 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I'll stick in a random number to originating player. :-) 
Tue May 12 03:40:52 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm not interested in getting into a countermeasure war, i'm genuinely curious what legitimate need there is for it 
Tue May 12 03:41:31 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Updating some files causes my channels to be unregistered and reregistered. The incorrect sequence of updates can trip a double register. 
Tue May 12 03:41:47 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I'm going to have a think. My intuition says its excessive 
Tue May 12 03:42:37 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Compared to mud updates spread over a -billion- packets from the router :-P 
Tue May 12 03:43:16 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: there are muds with poorly coded clients that do lame things like send the same channel-admin packet 40 times per second 
Tue May 12 03:43:35 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Well, thats bad. 
Tue May 12 03:43:37 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i had a hard time thinking of why it needed to happen more than once per second 
Tue May 12 03:43:42 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm open to suggestions 
Tue May 12 03:44:30 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Honestly I'm trying to review my log to try to comment, but I can't see many packets I've sent since the router filled my log up... 
Tue May 12 03:45:06 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Oh, oh, oh! 
Tue May 12 03:45:11 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: error packets. 
Tue May 12 03:45:24 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: What if I can make you send duplicate error packets? 
Tue May 12 03:47:28 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont understand 
Tue May 12 03:48:03 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: I mean, if I can make you send duplicate error packets within one second, will the router rate-limit you? 
Tue May 12 03:49:54 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh i see, like making another mud error 
Tue May 12 03:50:21 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: muds sending error packets to the router are outliers 
Tue May 12 03:50:26 2009 [imud_code] Ideysus@shadowmuddevdev: Well, the right exploit may let me DOS you. 
Tue May 12 03:50:45 2009 [imud_code] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's unusual, i only remember it on obscure libs 
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