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Fri Nov  6 02:38:10 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am not denying innovation Crat 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am saying it's limited 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:24 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev:  there are new ideas 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:40 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but just not many 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well with that attitude, yeah 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:48 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: lol 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:52 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh 
Fri Nov  6 02:38:58 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: I want SilC 
Fri Nov  6 02:39:08 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: LOL 
Fri Nov  6 02:39:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont have any fresh ideas unfortunately 
Fri Nov  6 02:39:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you aint kidn 
Fri Nov  6 02:39:34 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: A well-written program is its own heaven; a poorly-written program is its own hell. 
Fri Nov  6 02:39:59 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah but core languages you see in most papers 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not many fresh ideas 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: many dependent types is sort of fresh 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:17 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: Only a fool expects rational behavior from his fellow humans. Why do you expect it from a machine that humans have constructed? 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: er maybe 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:32 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: if you can look around and "ho hum" at the limits you see, it is because you stand on the shoulders of giants 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the fish does not know about water 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:52 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not what i am saying either 
Fri Nov  6 02:40:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i said there are innovations 
Fri Nov  6 02:41:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: GIANTS 
Fri Nov  6 02:41:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but there are more so many languages out there 
Fri Nov  6 02:41:17 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: Would you believe really big goats? 
Fri Nov  6 02:41:23 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it means very big people who also are tall 
Fri Nov  6 02:41:25 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: a lot of them just recycle stuff 
Fri Nov  6 02:43:16 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: lambda calculus = neat 
Fri Nov  6 02:43:47 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lol assignment operator. always evaluates as true 
Fri Nov  6 02:43:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: languages inspired by it also interesting lisp/scheme etc 
Fri Nov  6 02:44:12 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: programming in lisp is like speaking in japanese... it's all backwards 
Fri Nov  6 02:44:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: typed lambda calculi crossed type theory with lambda calculi 
Fri Nov  6 02:44:32 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: guess you get stuff like ML from that too 
Fri Nov  6 02:44:36 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: lamb broccoli... yum! 
Fri Nov  6 02:45:09 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: less original perhaps than lambda calculus itself but i guess still an interesting thing in some ways 
Fri Nov  6 02:45:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i guess you also have operational semantics 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:10 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: if you don't like the functional stuff 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:11 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yuckolic 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:16 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yuccoli 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:22 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yucckoli 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: for concurrent stuff there is a ton of models 
Fri Nov  6 02:46:54 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i like broccoli actually, but it's the melted cheese that really makes a good broc dish 
Fri Nov  6 02:47:14 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: or soy sauce. 
Fri Nov  6 02:47:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: a good gooey sauce too ya, like general tso's 
Fri Nov  6 02:47:40 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but new semantic models are few and far between except in the concurrent sphere i guess. 
Fri Nov  6 02:48:01 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: apparently that's pronounced "cho" 
Fri Nov  6 02:48:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and then a lot of stuff boils down to formal language theory or syntrax i.e. not much there either. 
Fri Nov  6 02:48:43 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: http://lpmuds.net/cho.gif 
Fri Nov  6 02:48:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: fair number of constructs you find in newer languages have existed for a long time 
Fri Nov  6 02:50:14 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: (: cho :) 
Fri Nov  6 02:50:31 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: functionals ftw :P 
Fri Nov  6 02:51:01 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no those are two people smiling with a cho between them 
Fri Nov  6 02:51:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so i was leafing through this month's Science magazine 
Fri Nov  6 02:51:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: :-) 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: anything interesting? 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:15 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: does it have naked sciency things in it? 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:18 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: (i became a member of the aaas due to an internet dispute and i needed access to a scholarly article) 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:33 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ah :-) 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and theyre like "hong kong, lol" 
Fri Nov  6 02:52:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: cuz apparently a vast number of schools are largely private 
Fri Nov  6 02:53:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and tons of them are creationist 
Fri Nov  6 02:53:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: wot schools? 
Fri Nov  6 02:53:28 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the ones with kids 
Fri Nov  6 02:53:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well that clarifies things :P 
Fri Nov  6 02:54:51 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and? 
Fri Nov  6 02:54:53 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well the article wasnt about listing the names 
Fri Nov  6 02:57:31 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: wot else did the article say? 
Fri Nov  6 02:57:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev looks at Hamlat suspishusly. 
Fri Nov  6 02:59:49 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh some blah blah yadda about some government thing ruling that evolution should be taught 
Fri Nov  6 03:00:05 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and how toothless the ordinance was and that prolly it wont change much 
Fri Nov  6 03:00:10 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and what made you mention it? 
Fri Nov  6 03:00:56 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i was mostly educated while i was studying in HK in the ESF system 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:08 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not too familiar with the chinese school system 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:15 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: who knows how my crazy mind works 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but i do know 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:22 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i know i dont 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:24 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: communist school system 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: that a lot o f the schools are founded by the church originally 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so there might be a bit too that. 
Fri Nov  6 03:01:55 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh i know now 
Fri Nov  6 03:02:08 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but that's the first i heard of it 
Fri Nov  6 03:02:24 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i wanted to derail you from the lambda metaparadigm synoclastic phase talk 
Fri Nov  6 03:02:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: figured that hk + fundamentalists would do the job 
Fri Nov  6 03:02:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and it did! 
Fri Nov  6 03:02:48 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but i already stopped doing that :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'll take credit all the same 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:02 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so wots the point? 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: go ahead be my guest :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: this is intermud. point is optional 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:32 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh 
Fri Nov  6 03:03:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: did you make all that up? 
Fri Nov  6 03:04:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no thats a real thing, check the latest issue 
Fri Nov  6 03:04:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well a lot of the schools = taught by priests and nuns in the old days 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so who knows 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:13 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: dont you think the lambda paradigm is kinda old now tho? i mean, that's not really innovation 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's more like fancy self-reference dressed up as cleverness 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:37 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it was when it was constructed tho 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so was the wheel 
Fri Nov  6 03:05:55 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: you want to get back on this topic? :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:04 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: naw i just wanna get off the nuns now 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:13 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: figured the lambdas would do it 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:33 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so you are trolling :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:40 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no i'm oscillating 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:46 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and trolling :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:06:49 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you don't blame cesium for being cesium, do you? 
Fri Nov  6 03:07:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: definitely trolling :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:07:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but oh no. let crat do it, and he's the bad guy 
Fri Nov  6 03:07:13 2009 [dchat] Ideysus@ShadowMUDii: Yeah, but after the wheel was around a bit people didn't just create square ones to be innovative. :-P 
Fri Nov  6 03:08:20 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: "this one is crimson! not the old, boring wood color" 
Fri Nov  6 03:08:31 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: "that's...that's blood" 
Fri Nov  6 03:08:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: "oh suddenly i'm the bad guy" 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:01 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:08 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but you were trolling me :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:20 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont think you care which way the answer turned out :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's not that i dont care 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:47 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm just brave enough to accept whatever tyhe truth is 
Fri Nov  6 03:09:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so even though i could defend lambda calc and waste time 
Fri Nov  6 03:10:03 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont think you even care about the answer 
Fri Nov  6 03:10:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: heh member that time we were debating set theory 
Fri Nov  6 03:10:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and you couldnt tell if i knew what i was talking about 
Fri Nov  6 03:10:39 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that was my favorite 
Fri Nov  6 03:10:52 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: oh i didnt think that was a debate 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that's what the loser would say 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:07 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and i could actually tell 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:14 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh sure you say that now 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:16 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i wasnt sure how much you knew :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: seriously dude 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:32 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: you always think about things in terms of winners and losers 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:44 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am one of those ppl who doesnt care :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: cuz when you win, it's obvious 
Fri Nov  6 03:11:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i just like discussions 
Fri Nov  6 03:12:03 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: when you lose, it's "complicated" 
Fri Nov  6 03:12:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: doesnt matter who wins or loses 
Fri Nov  6 03:12:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont even thing of it as win for me 
Fri Nov  6 03:12:30 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: just discussion to find more information about the subject 
Fri Nov  6 03:12:38 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and sometimes it is complicated :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:05 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: as you yourself pointed out 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:14 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but look at you 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:15 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am motivated by curiosity primarily 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:18 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: look at you right now 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:21 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: right this minute 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:24 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: this very moment 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:26 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and? 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:28 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: just sayin 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you're more competitive than you pretend 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:47 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:54 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but my motives are 
Fri Nov  6 03:13:56 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: learn moar 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh sure, hem and haw 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not win the current debate 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:08 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but you know i say truthness 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:19 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so if you are saying that is competitiveness sure 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:39 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but i direct most of my competitiveness into learn moar mode 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i smile in rich smugness 
Fri Nov  6 03:14:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not in winning debates 
Fri Nov  6 03:15:44 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: crat i try to clarify and seek truth not win/lose so much in the immediate sense 
Fri Nov  6 03:15:52 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: meh 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i.e. if someone points out some facts i am not aware of 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:12 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you advocate an adversarial dialectic 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:15 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: or arguments 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:17 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i advocate it too 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:22 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am like fun fun 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im just more ok with the mechanics of it 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont mind dialectic 
Fri Nov  6 03:16:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you aint kidn 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: rhetoric i dont like so much 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:12 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: rhetoric gets a bad rhap 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:16 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but then again i am more of a science guy 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so that might be why 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:22 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it is the coin of the realm and the tool of debate 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:33 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: as i said i 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:38 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: dont really like debates 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: rhetoric for its own sake leads to specius sophistry, sure 
Fri Nov  6 03:17:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i like discussions 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i.e. getting closer to the truth 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but "i dont like rhetoric" is like "i dont like hammers or screwdrivers" 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:16 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's what we got as tools for the whole language thang 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:23 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: depends on what you are doing with language 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:31 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i do magic 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:32 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: if you are debating sure 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: if you are trying to employ dialectical reasoning to try to understand something 
Fri Nov  6 03:18:59 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: maybe not so useful 
Fri Nov  6 03:19:13 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well im pretty sure on intermud "useful" is relative 
Fri Nov  6 03:19:23 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: amirite 
Fri Nov  6 03:19:27 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and as i said rhetoric i dont like but i mean personally 
Fri Nov  6 03:19:35 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not that you shouldnt like it 
Fri Nov  6 03:19:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i might just not understand it that well 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: ohh.. suddenly yer socrates 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: eh? 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:29 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: dc is joak. socrates would pretend to be ignorant of basic concepts 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: oh you mean in plato's dialogues? 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:47 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that is what i mean 
Fri Nov  6 03:20:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ah heh nah i wish i knew that trick 
Fri Nov  6 03:21:01 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but i dont 
Fri Nov  6 03:21:13 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i just taught it to ya. use it in good health, sir 
Fri Nov  6 03:21:19 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i just picked up a book on rhetoric sort of 
Fri Nov  6 03:21:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: just in case i need it for certain types of writing 
Fri Nov  6 03:21:55 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well what people can use more of is not an understanding of "rhetoric" so much 
Fri Nov  6 03:22:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but in general when i am vetting ideas i use dialctical tools only. 
Fri Nov  6 03:22:10 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: as an understanding of fallacies, how to spot them, and how to avoid them 
Fri Nov  6 03:22:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: the problem is 
Fri Nov  6 03:22:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: what i think is most often identified as "just rhetoric" is, i think, actually fallacious argument 
Fri Nov  6 03:22:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: for me anyhow 
Fri Nov  6 03:23:31 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well i guess fallacy = flawed dialectic? 
Fri Nov  6 03:23:43 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well it's a failure of reasoning 
Fri Nov  6 03:23:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: for me i am talking about rhetorical devices 
Fri Nov  6 03:24:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: which sway public opinion on an emotive level 
Fri Nov  6 03:24:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but have no real sound basis i.e. you could interpret either way 
Fri Nov  6 03:24:32 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: sometimes those are jokes 
Fri Nov  6 03:24:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i think politicians use those a lot. 
Fri Nov  6 03:24:51 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yes and no 
Fri Nov  6 03:25:11 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: generally politicians behave as they feel they must in order to be elected 
Fri Nov  6 03:25:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well relatively speaking 
Fri Nov  6 03:25:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so they dont do very much rhetorical suasion 
Fri Nov  6 03:25:26 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: compared to reading some argued piece in a science journal. 
Fri Nov  6 03:25:32 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: as much as rhetorical self defense 
Fri Nov  6 03:26:28 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well anyhow i just would like to understand what the subject is about since i do find people do use rhetorical devices quite a bit 
Fri Nov  6 03:26:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and a lot of them have emotive impact 
Fri Nov  6 03:26:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's a social thing 
Fri Nov  6 03:26:54 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but on some level arguably it is just that 
Fri Nov  6 03:27:03 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you should read the cratylus, actually 
Fri Nov  6 03:27:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: beyond the emotive impact there might be little substance. 
Fri Nov  6 03:27:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: what is that dialogue about? 
Fri Nov  6 03:27:20 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: imo it's pretty much about this thing 
Fri Nov  6 03:27:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: on the surface there's a silly debate about where words come from 
Fri Nov  6 03:28:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but i think it deals on a deeper level with the nature of debate 
Fri Nov  6 03:28:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: imo what puzzles you is the social aspect of rhetoric 
Fri Nov  6 03:28:59 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that you will not undestand from a book 
Fri Nov  6 03:29:46 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well partly i just want to identify the techniques in the written form mostly at this time 
Fri Nov  6 03:29:48 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: for example, allow me to drop my normal sill ything for a moment 
Fri Nov  6 03:29:56 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i like you and like talking with you 
Fri Nov  6 03:30:22 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: in doing so, i occasionally indulge in humorous digressions 
Fri Nov  6 03:30:30 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: digressions *I* find humorous, in any case 
Fri Nov  6 03:30:54 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: which you might interpret as trolling, but i interpret as jocular use of language with someone i like to talk with 
Fri Nov  6 03:31:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i think this is what you find confusing 
Fri Nov  6 03:31:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: oh sure i was half joking too :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:31:16 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: what you're saying is that you enjoy trolling 
Fri Nov  6 03:31:19 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: not really "rhetoric" as a formal subject of study 
Fri Nov  6 03:31:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but anyhow cozminsky does have a point :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:32:03 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i.e. i wasnt like some guy accusing you of seriously offensive trolling in this case 
Fri Nov  6 03:32:06 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: also wittgenstein 
Fri Nov  6 03:32:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i was kind of teasing you :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:33:43 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: it also comes down to culture and familiarity 
Fri Nov  6 03:34:18 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: the trolling is much more frequent and intense on imud_gossip 
Fri Nov  6 03:34:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah could be 
Fri Nov  6 03:34:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well i think that in general there is a differenc ebetween trolling and goofing around 
Fri Nov  6 03:35:31 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont really follow intergossip 
Fri Nov  6 03:35:44 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: nog, but if you're used to serious discussions in a particular forum then your tolerance for goofing around gets lower 
Fri Nov  6 03:36:08 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: for example, there's a fella i know that's liable to say stuff about how people who think global warming is real are just dumb etc 
Fri Nov  6 03:36:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and will keep saying stuff like that til someone finally bites and attempts to refute the argument 
Fri Nov  6 03:36:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and then that person is used as an amusing chew toy 
Fri Nov  6 03:37:03 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that's meanspirited and what i would be inclined to call trolling 
Fri Nov  6 03:37:29 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: whereas me goofin around pokin at silenus for being more competitive than he lets on 
Fri Nov  6 03:37:33 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that's goofin around 
Fri Nov  6 03:37:55 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i guess for me it's just posting something that deliberately tries to provoke a reaction from a person or persons 
Fri Nov  6 03:38:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: on issues where you dont really care too much 
Fri Nov  6 03:38:25 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: about 
Fri Nov  6 03:38:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: usually for amusement value mostly i guess. 
Fri Nov  6 03:39:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well good thing im not that provocative 
Fri Nov  6 03:39:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: like some guy on a gaming forum posting things likes OMG my class sucks for x y z 
Fri Nov  6 03:39:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: 1999 was 10 years ago 
Fri Nov  6 03:39:54 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: mischan 
Fri Nov  6 03:40:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: in reality probably he doesnt even play said class 
Fri Nov  6 03:40:25 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and just wants to see ppl react 
Fri Nov  6 03:41:05 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont mind that so much 
Fri Nov  6 03:41:07 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so you get a bunch of posts attacking this persons supposed position 
Fri Nov  6 03:41:24 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and probably the person in question is just like LOL 
Fri Nov  6 03:41:27 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: what annoys me is wastes-of-time, those impervious to reason 
Fri Nov  6 03:41:59 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: stuff like that doesnt bother me too much but i think that it is a form of baiting which isn't so nice. 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:20 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: some people are boot at baiting 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: kali is a master at it 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:28 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well i find impervious to reason stuff just hard to 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:35 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh no doubt :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:38 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: deal with too 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: a master baiter 
Fri Nov  6 03:42:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but it's like i just give up before i start 
Fri Nov  6 03:43:16 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well i like to try to "reach" them 
Fri Nov  6 03:43:21 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: like nafe and fury 
Fri Nov  6 03:43:33 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but eventually you just...there's not much to do 
Fri Nov  6 03:43:39 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah. 
Fri Nov  6 03:43:52 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: you cannot really do much it's like arguing about religion with someone 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:04 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: they will always find reasons to believe their position 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it's not about reason 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:19 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it's about faith 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:27 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: unless they don't have a position 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:29 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so ends up 
Fri Nov  6 03:44:44 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: they just go back and find new ways to substantiate their position 
Fri Nov  6 03:45:05 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: mostly ad infinitum 
Fri Nov  6 03:45:34 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: or get extremely discouraged i.e. crisis of faith 
Fri Nov  6 03:45:43 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: then they should not argue with me 
Fri Nov  6 03:45:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: which might be even a worse situation to be in. 
Fri Nov  6 03:46:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well i guess in a public forum it's a bit of a problem 
Fri Nov  6 03:46:22 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: remember the guy with the soapy ants? 
Fri Nov  6 03:46:25 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i guess in private it's like well 
Fri Nov  6 03:46:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: just let it be is my attitude 
Fri Nov  6 03:46:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah 
Fri Nov  6 03:47:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: unless of course they are too assertive about it and trying to force their pov down your throat so to speak. 
Fri Nov  6 03:48:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well 
Fri Nov  6 03:48:55 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: if they're wrong, then that's ok to say 
Fri Nov  6 03:49:20 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: their reaction sometimes winds up turning overly aggressive as a result 
Fri Nov  6 03:49:29 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: hard to say "who started it" 
Fri Nov  6 03:49:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but i think it's ok to point out that soapy ants dont actually kill each other 
Fri Nov  6 03:49:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: oh sure 
Fri Nov  6 03:50:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i think the problem in a public forum sometimes also is the guy loses face if you press too hard 
Fri Nov  6 03:50:26 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it's ok to say the guy is wrong 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: also in your position i think versus some unknown guy we do know that usually you do check your facts out properly. 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: dude i got a membership to aaas, no less 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:35 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so once you said that i dont think many people would have believed him 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: LOL 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:53 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: thes ejournals are way too smart for me 
Fri Nov  6 03:51:59 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i know some guys who do reach nature on a regular basis 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:10 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: or did know 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:19 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but its usually the prof science types 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:34 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: dont think anyone else really pays close attention to that stuff 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: theyre like the plantangent cosine og b sub x should alert the clever reader of the echo super theta sine wave coefficient 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: lol 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:52 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im like "durrrrrrrr" 
Fri Nov  6 03:52:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yep :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:53:29 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am a pretty hard core science guy and if it's outside certain areas which i have studied i really dont have a clue either :D 
Fri Nov  6 03:53:58 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: looking back on it, i dont think i even needed to do that 
Fri Nov  6 03:54:30 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i have a computer inside a uni network, i cuda just accessed one of three dozen scholarly access sites 
Fri Nov  6 03:54:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ah yeah 
Fri Nov  6 03:54:47 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: if you have a machine like that 
Fri Nov  6 03:54:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: musta been drunk 
Fri Nov  6 03:54:56 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: you can get their ejournal access 
Fri Nov  6 03:55:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah 
Fri Nov  6 03:55:21 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: heat of the moment i guess 
Fri Nov  6 10:25:57 2009 [dchat] Nilrin@Rebirth: Just finished my first Discworld book today. Good stuff. 
Fri Nov  6 14:32:04 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: morninging 
Fri Nov  6 15:33:12 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good morning 
Fri Nov  6 15:33:43 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: fridays are typically good, yes! 
Fri Nov  6 15:33:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: soup 
Fri Nov  6 19:11:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: wheee.  "out of memory!" 
Fri Nov  6 19:11:13 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: never want a webserver to report that.  even indirectly. 
Fri Nov  6 20:46:15 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: what's sokkard? 
Fri Nov  6 20:46:35 2009 [dchat] Connick@Discworld: Hyuk hyuk. It's an NPC. 
Fri Nov  6 20:59:45 2009 [dchat] Tricky@Rock the Halo: Try "System Error: socket_connect: connect:No buffer space available"... Only thing I could do about that was to reboot. 
Fri Nov  6 21:04:22 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: lovely. 
Sat Nov  7 03:56:13 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: Thank you for submitting your payment. 
Sat Nov  7 03:59:09 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: heh 
Sun Nov  8 11:07:19 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: "I'm missing you like a hijacked flight on sept 11."  Wow this guy's a jerk. 
Sun Nov  8 16:12:43 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: is there a command you can use in ds muds that lets you list all the players? if you arent a wiz? 
Sun Nov  8 16:12:59 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: users 
Sun Nov  8 16:13:01 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: who 
Sun Nov  8 16:13:15 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: thanks i know about who ofc 
Sun Nov  8 16:16:17 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: i meant to list users who have signed up, like users who arent online atm 
Sun Nov  8 16:16:50 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: Oh 
Sun Nov  8 16:16:56 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: nod 
Sun Nov  8 16:16:58 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: You could write one, but it would be ugly 
Sun Nov  8 16:17:09 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: lol 
Sun Nov  8 16:17:10 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: Haven has a "highscore" command that sorts the players by skill points. 
Sun Nov  8 16:17:32 2009 [dchat] Duuk@Haven: but it's not one I could send you, because it requires quite a bit of Haven-specific calls. 
Sun Nov  8 16:17:48 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: [24~[24~[24~[24~[24~[24~[24~ 
Sun Nov  8 16:17:53 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: ooops 
Sun Nov  8 16:18:15 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: hmmm must be careful what keys i press when im usuing anyterm 
Sun Nov  8 16:19:08 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: dreamverse is listed in mudlist it kicks ass and i like that mud and i wanted to mudmail whoever runs it etc, their website dont work 
Sun Nov  8 16:21:10 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: anyone here like the tv series LEXX? 
Sun Nov  8 16:21:21 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: andromeda was good 
Sun Nov  8 16:22:21 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: lexx doesnt quite hold my attention as good as that tho, and sarah conner chronicles season 2 did my head in, the last episode was like a cliff hanger and then its cancelld and thats that NOOOO! 
Sun Nov  8 16:24:05 2009 [dchat] Nafe@The Pussy Cat Forest: this anyterm is really responsive etc under firefox and linux, its so slow with firefox and windows you would think that the same version of firefox would run the same speed but it dont, and java stuff like runescape is really bad in windows 
Sun Nov  8 20:01:52 2009 [dchat] Bardioc@Evermore: Hello everybody! 
Sun Nov  8 20:08:42 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: Bardi! 
Mon Nov  9 03:05:29 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: fear. 
Mon Nov  9 03:07:05 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: fear is a shady thing 
Mon Nov  9 03:11:04 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: 278,367 lines of chatlog on 51 channels, with 1,356 people talking. 
Mon Nov  9 03:11:15 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: that's my sql-stored total so far, since i last wiped it. 
Mon Nov  9 03:14:16 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: it's about 60MiB of datas. 
Mon Nov  9 03:14:38 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: which is a metric asston less than if it were in plaintext. 
Mon Nov  9 03:14:39 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: that is so foreign 
Mon Nov  9 03:14:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: only foreign people say MiB 
Mon Nov  9 03:15:02 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: no, phpmyadmin says mib. and I invoked my right to copypasta. 
Mon Nov  9 03:15:06 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: So there. 
Mon Nov  9 03:15:07 2009 [dchat] Cozminsky@EotL: s/foreign/pedantic 
Mon Nov  9 03:15:10 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape bonks Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev on Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev's head. BONK! BONK! 
Mon Nov  9 03:17:08 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Wow. the orc in the menagerie is uberhax. I zapped all, and he didn't die. Almost, though. 
Mon Nov  9 03:17:24 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the wraith is pretty haxy 
Mon Nov  9 03:17:39 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: yeah. he's busy being invis and stuff. 
Mon Nov  9 03:17:46 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: too busy to take wizdamage. 
Mon Nov  9 03:45:17 2009 [dchat] Detah@Arcania: good evening 
Mon Nov  9 14:24:32 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good morning 
Mon Nov  9 14:24:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: detah detah bo betah 
Mon Nov  9 14:24:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: banana fanna fo fetah 
Mon Nov  9 17:11:34 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: the silence leaves me concerned that the zombocalypse has begun. 
Mon Nov  9 17:11:45 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: it's ok, we're armed 
Mon Nov  9 17:11:47 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: (doesn't help that I had zombie dreams all night, I suppose) 
Mon Nov  9 17:11:56 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: fast zombies or slow zombies? 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:18 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: fast zombies may make fun video games but that shit is no fun in RL 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:21 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: oh dang 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: my bad my bad 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:29 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: b& 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:33 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: do it 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:34 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: fairly slow.  too bad that it turns out that dull knives take a LOT of force behind them to get through a skull.  (and my dream-self was weaker even than I actually am) 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:35 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: ban crat 
Mon Nov  9 17:12:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yellow card for me sry guys 
Mon Nov  9 17:13:52 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: tsk.  Luckily, "fair" is only relevant to public institutions.  Crat makes rules, Crat does what he wants with rules.  By definition, this is fair. 
Mon Nov  9 17:14:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no 
Mon Nov  9 17:14:02 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: fascisim 
Mon Nov  9 17:14:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im for real sry 
Mon Nov  9 17:14:11 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: 4 legs better than 2 legs! 
Mon Nov  9 17:14:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: been chattin on ig, it just slipped out 
Mon Nov  9 17:15:38 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: anyway, the point is that if you have a dull knife and you're a weakling, RUNNING from the zombie is probably a better idea.  especially if they're slow. 
Mon Nov  9 17:16:07 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: otherwise, you find yourself stuck wrestling with a zombie while you try desperately to find a way to get the knife through. 
Mon Nov  9 17:16:14 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: and that's no fun at all. 
Mon Nov  9 17:16:42 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: weak dream-selves are a pain 
Mon Nov  9 17:16:53 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i hate that :( 
Mon Nov  9 17:17:11 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i'm all like gonna give a guy a huge right hook but it's like i'm punching through jello 
Mon Nov  9 17:17:12 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: every now and then i'll have one where i cant do anything at all 
Mon Nov  9 17:17:31 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: stuck, hands useless, useless 
Mon Nov  9 17:17:51 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i read an article that this may actually have something to do with being almost awake while dreaming 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:02 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: I had one of those once and woke up still paralysed.  took me half a minute to get out of the covers.  still panicked, of course. 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yer brain supposedly locks you up when deaming 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:08 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: right 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:19 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so you dont get up and start physically acting out 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:30 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: makes sense. 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:32 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and if you're kind of semi awake you can tell you can't move 
Mon Nov  9 17:18:42 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: "unfortunate feedback" 
Mon Nov  9 17:21:43 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: anyway, I'd advise against exploring a darkened office building alone after the zombocalypse has begun.  Especially with just a dull knife. 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: too easy to get cornered. 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:12 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but my fathers watch is in there 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:24 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: uh huh.  find another one. 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: do you have any idea what it took for him to get that watch to me? 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:32 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: heh 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:36 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: walken 
Mon Nov  9 17:22:38 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: he rules 
Mon Nov  9 17:23:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: uh huh.  get another watch.  SPEAKING OF: I wore my watch today for the first time in a while.  so of course I forgot my namebadge. 
Mon Nov  9 17:23:02 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west mutters something under his breath. 
Mon Nov  9 17:26:44 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: ok, I give up.  what determines in an html table whether the data rows have the same or different background color than the header row? 
Mon Nov  9 17:26:56 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: the style applied 
Mon Nov  9 17:27:13 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: tables don't implicitly have a header row 
Mon Nov  9 17:27:42 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: hm.  I'm just cutting and pasting.  I assumed th would be header and td would be data? 
Mon Nov  9 17:28:22 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: oh you're right 
Mon Nov  9 17:28:28 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: is there a stylesheet attached? 
Mon Nov  9 17:28:43 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: .css?  yeah, seem to be two of them. 
Mon Nov  9 17:28:46 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: otherwise you can apply bgcolor to the <tr> 
Mon Nov  9 17:28:59 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: it's probably defined in there as a default for all <th> tags then 
Mon Nov  9 17:30:08 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: maybe that's the problem.  doesn't seem to have a bgcolor in any of the .css's. 
Mon Nov  9 17:30:37 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i guess i should ask what the issue is first? ;) 
Mon Nov  9 17:31:15 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: background isn't going lighter for the data rows.  *shrug*  it's apparently supposed to. 
Mon Nov  9 17:32:03 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: ugh.  the "official" stylesheet is a perl script.  lovely. 
Mon Nov  9 17:32:18 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: referencing a database entry, I suspect. 
Tue Nov 10 14:07:28 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good morning 
Tue Nov 10 14:08:17 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: every mountain and hill shall be made low 
Tue Nov 10 18:04:57 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west whistles . 
Tue Nov 10 18:16:25 2009 [dchat] whistles appreciatively too. (from Bardioc@Evermore) 
Thu Nov 12 15:33:14 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: hmmmm.  bash on this machine does not seem to be responding to window resizes.  I've never seen that before. 
Thu Nov 12 18:25:19 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good afternoon 
Thu Nov 12 18:31:49 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: heya D 
Thu Nov 12 19:30:07 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: hm.  I wonder if my company pushes non-windows patches through the windows update thing.  is that possible?  It seems odd to me that XP is still receiving daily updates from MS. 
Thu Nov 12 20:03:23 2009 [dchat] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: XP's still getting regular patches 
Thu Nov 12 20:03:40 2009 [dchat] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: But AFAIK, you can't use the internal Windows Update server to push out non-microsoft patches 
Thu Nov 12 20:04:01 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: it's also possible to setup your own WU servers in an NT domain 
Thu Nov 12 20:04:14 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: You can use it for anything 
Thu Nov 12 20:04:43 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: It's just detectoid logic and msi/msu/exe packages 
Thu Nov 12 20:05:07 2009 [dchat] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: wu-tang clan 
Thu Nov 12 20:07:04 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: they are allegedly nothing to eff with 
Thu Nov 12 20:13:23 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: oh.  that seems a shame. 
Fri Nov 13 14:22:11 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good morning 
Fri Nov 13 14:22:19 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: morning :) 
Fri Nov 13 14:23:31 2009 [dchat] Sys@BlackHole: arvo 
Fri Nov 13 14:23:35 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: hiya. 
Fri Nov 13 16:54:24 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: wonder if I should get a motorola droid over the nokia n900 
Fri Nov 13 16:58:17 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: the droid commercials are funny 
Fri Nov 13 17:04:50 2009 [dchat] Bardioc@Evermore: Hey, good evening ;-) (at least for me *grins) ... Sil Id go with the droid, nice phone! 
Fri Nov 13 17:05:10 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: Bardi! 
Fri Nov 13 17:06:13 2009 [dchat] Bardioc@Evermore: Hey Kalinash :-) 
Fri Nov 13 17:06:43 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: I wish it were evening here... still morning.  at least it's friday :) 
Fri Nov 13 17:07:18 2009 [dchat] Bardioc@Evermore: Well I had a day off, so it was even nice at the morning ;-) 
Fri Nov 13 17:07:40 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: one more week for me then i'm taking thanksgiving week off 
Fri Nov 13 17:09:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: hello Bardioc :-) 
Fri Nov 13 17:09:55 2009 [dchat] Bardioc@Evermore: Hey Sil :-) 
Fri Nov 13 17:11:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well off to bed :-) 
Fri Nov 13 17:11:48 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: night all 
Sat Nov 14 05:58:31 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west claps his hands . 
Sat Nov 14 05:59:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west:  perl -e '@iana=`wget -O- http://www.iana.org/domains/root/db/index.html`; foreach (@iana) { if($_ =~ />\.(.*)<\/a><\/td><td>country-code<\/td><td>(.*)<br\/>/) { my $dom=lc($1);  my $desc=$2; $html=`wget -O- http://www.iana.org/domains/root/db/$dom.html 2> /dev/null`; if($html =~ /WHOIS Server:<\/b> (.*?)</) { printf "%-8s : %-28s, %s\n", "\"$dom\"", "\"$1\"", "/* $desc */"; } } }'     
Sat Nov 14 06:05:39 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev blinks. 
Sat Nov 14 06:08:02 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: do that again and i'll kill you 
Sat Nov 14 06:08:35 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: promise? 
Sat Nov 14 06:08:44 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: maybe 
Sat Nov 14 06:12:08 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: you know it's slick code. 
Sat Nov 14 06:18:50 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: hm.  didn't slice out quite all the html from the comments.  gr. 
Sat Nov 14 09:54:43 2009 [dchat] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: In soviet russa, html slice YOU. 
Sat Nov 14 09:55:07 2009 [dchat] Ninja@Dead Souls Dev: typoe intentional to avoid copyright suit. 
Sun Nov 15 01:31:33 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: gnome 2.28 is very pretty, looks like they tried to take some lessons from modern os ui's 
Sun Nov 15 01:32:03 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: this coming from the guy who thinks that Windows 2000 was the pinnacle of UI design 
Sun Nov 15 01:33:15 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well im considering turning off some of this stuff 
Sun Nov 15 01:33:35 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: switching workspaces does this "rotating cube" effect that is kinda disorienting 
Sun Nov 15 01:33:46 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: then just use xfce 
Sun Nov 15 01:33:49 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: btw how do you enable workspaces in windows 7? 
Sun Nov 15 01:34:03 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: use multiple monitors 
Sun Nov 15 01:34:11 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: or enable it 
Sun Nov 15 01:34:13 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: gotcha 
Sun Nov 15 01:39:56 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: cool thx 
Sun Nov 15 01:44:52 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: ah, hell.  messed up my bottom program-select panel thing. 
Sun Nov 15 01:45:14 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC-west: kind of hard to get excited about trying to fix it when OS reinstall is coming very soon. 
Sun Nov 15 01:45:16 2009 [dchat] Ideysus@ShadowMUDii: Wow, they actually did workspaces at last? 
Sun Nov 15 01:51:27 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: the OS supports it but it's not a standard feature. 
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