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Tue Jun 23 16:23:43 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: Crat, getting Lars to post was just awesome :P  Nice work. 
Tue Jun 23 16:24:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm amazed 
Tue Jun 23 16:24:54 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yknow wats funny, it was easier getting a hold of him than greg stein 
Tue Jun 23 16:24:58 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: lars lives? 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: go fig 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:08 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah he posted on lpmuds.net 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:13 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: lies 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:31 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the ip checks out, the email address looks right, and, well, it just sounds right too 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:34 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: pretty amazin 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:39 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: well, SOMEONE who doesn't speak English as a first language posted.  We'll have to take Crat's word for it actually being Lars :P 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:55 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah. i cant share the evidence i have since its personal info 
Tue Jun 23 16:25:59 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but it looks like lars to me 
Tue Jun 23 16:26:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC nods. 
Tue Jun 23 16:28:21 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: and crat IS a professional stalker 
Tue Jun 23 16:28:48 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i felt so bad 
Tue Jun 23 16:28:56 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i even called what i thought was his house 
Tue Jun 23 16:29:08 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: so who is lars lives? 
Tue Jun 23 16:29:09 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: greg's that is 
Tue Jun 23 16:29:23 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lars pensjo, inventor of lpmud 
Tue Jun 23 16:29:41 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: oh, lol 
Tue Jun 23 16:30:45 2009 [dchat] Sys@BlackHole: got a link to lars' post? 
Tue Jun 23 16:31:16 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: lpmuds.net/forum 
Tue Jun 23 16:31:27 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: scroll down to the recent posts list 
Tue Jun 23 16:31:57 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Haldir Needs to Think About This.: Hey, Cratylus, thanks a bunch for your help. 
Tue Jun 23 16:33:10 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: np. did it work? 
Tue Jun 23 16:33:22 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Haldir Needs to Think About This.: yup 
Tue Jun 23 16:33:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you should post that, so people reading the thread in the future know 
Tue Jun 23 16:34:06 2009 [dchat] Sys@BlackHole: wow! I post for LP on lpmuds.net, my ghast is flabbered 
Tue Jun 23 16:34:07 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Haldir Needs to Think About This.: Okay. Sorry I had so many problems, I'm not that great at coding. 
Tue Jun 23 16:34:20 2009 [dchat] Sys@BlackHole: s/I/a/ 
Tue Jun 23 16:34:47 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: is that why the tavern keeper's name is Lars? 
Tue Jun 23 16:34:52 2009 [dchat] Sys@BlackHole: yes 
Tue Jun 23 16:35:00 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua learnt something 
Tue Jun 23 16:36:37 2009 [dchat] Zaknafein@AoD TempMUD: its also what LPC stands for: Lars Pensjo's C 
Tue Jun 23 18:35:04 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: and this for general chat. 
Tue Jun 23 19:12:01 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Cool, thunderstorm's coming. 
Tue Jun 23 19:13:15 2009 [dchat] Zaknafein@AoD TempMUD: I wish we'd get one, its so damn hot and humid right now 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:02 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: where r u from? 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:19 2009 [dchat] Zaknafein@AoD TempMUD: MI 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:23 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: is that miami? 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:28 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Lodz, center of Poland, Europe. 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:33 2009 [dchat] Zaknafein@AoD TempMUD: heh, michigan 
Tue Jun 23 19:15:36 2009 [dchat] Tricky@Rock the Halo: It's cooling off around here now - BD4 - UK 
Tue Jun 23 19:16:04 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: WHOA! Wall Of Water (tm). 
Tue Jun 23 19:16:24 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: soz wow an andrezj sapkowsky comrade? 
Tue Jun 23 19:16:55 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: soz, i'm from spain not used to USA States diminutives 
Tue Jun 23 19:17:24 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Yep, he lives in here. But it's a big city ;) 
Tue Jun 23 19:17:39 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: i do love his Geralt *^-^* 
Tue Jun 23 19:17:43 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: knowing him from the books or the game? 
Tue Jun 23 19:17:53 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: both xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:17:58 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Good. 
Tue Jun 23 19:18:02 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: fan to death xd 
Tue Jun 23 19:18:12 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: i have the game but still haven't played 'cos of the spoilers 
Tue Jun 23 19:18:49 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: here we're waiting for the last book to be translated, but now we have Narrentum while waiting =) 
Tue Jun 23 19:19:17 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Narrenturm is waaaay different in both world and style of writing... but it's still a good read. 
Tue Jun 23 19:19:35 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: i also know zaknaffein though =P have read Dark Elf trilogy 
Tue Jun 23 19:19:45 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: yeah seems like =) 
Tue Jun 23 19:20:19 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I'm surprised there's a spanish translation at all... iirc there's not even an english one yet. 
Tue Jun 23 19:20:49 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: believe it or not, but it was first in spanish tan english i think xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:21:24 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Good for ya. I wonder how well they ported the language jokes... 
Tue Jun 23 19:21:31 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: he has a nice fandom here =) you'd be surprised to see 
Tue Jun 23 19:22:34 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I'll be surprised if i'll ever visit Spain.  Traveling is expensive ;( 
Tue Jun 23 19:22:41 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: ugh... i don't really want to know xD as I know no polish i can not value 
Tue Jun 23 19:22:55 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: come and see but tell us first =P =) 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:03 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: oooh witcher discussion? 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:03 2009 [dchat] Tricky@Rock the Halo: Well that's the fins de-fluffed. 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:17 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: yeah 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:23 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: seems so :) 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:31 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: geralt, but 
Tue Jun 23 19:23:57 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: please no spoliers xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:05 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: No more FluffOS? 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:13 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: haven't read the last one :_ 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:19 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: i want to get my hands on a book in english. geralt is quite a badass. 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:25 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: don't worry, no spoilers from me 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:33 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: how dare you ¬¬ 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:33 2009 [dchat] Tricky@Rock the Halo: cya all l8r - off to a meeting and then some more drinking. 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:48 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:24:56 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: you'll burn in hell xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:02 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: i'll be quite comfy in hell, i'll bring an air conditioner and cheeseburgers 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:06 2009 [dchat] Aransus@Pyloros: later tricky 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:11 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: hey guys must leave too =) going out for dancing xD 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:17 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Good plan, Tricky. 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:24 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev waves. 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:39 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: see you tomorrow so =) and pleased to meet you 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:54 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: how to emote along the chanel? 
Tue Jun 23 19:25:59 2009 [dchat] Tricky@Rock the Halo: Productive day... fixed i3logs... :) 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:05 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev:  dc :smiles. 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:10 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis smiles 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:17 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice *^-^* 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:24 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: There's a bunch of predefined ones... 'help feelings'. You just do :command for these. 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:33 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: so c ya, have a nice huh... say or so xD =) 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:45 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Will do. 
Tue Jun 23 19:26:55 2009 [dchat] Visenya@Valar Morghulis: *^-^* 
Tue Jun 23 19:27:16 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev grins vaguely. 
Tue Jun 23 19:36:00 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape meuhs. 
Tue Jun 23 19:36:59 2009 [dchat] Eddard@Valar Morghulis: on 
Tue Jun 23 19:37:05 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QS2 meuhs. 
Tue Jun 23 19:44:04 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev yips. 
Tue Jun 23 22:29:20 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QS2: meuh 
Wed Jun 24 01:54:05 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: nested commit/rollbacks 
Wed Jun 24 01:54:27 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: how so? 
Wed Jun 24 01:54:55 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i.e. being able to sort of do partial rollbacks 
Wed Jun 24 01:55:04 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: nesting transactions inside one another 
Wed Jun 24 01:55:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it's just sometimes i worry with MySQL that also I wont use half the features 
Wed Jun 24 01:55:56 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Transactions cannot be nested. This is a consequence of the implicit commit performed for any current transaction when you issue a START TRANSACTION statement or one of its synonyms. 
Wed Jun 24 01:56:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ok hmm 
Wed Jun 24 01:56:27 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: why would you need to nest transactions? 
Wed Jun 24 01:56:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am trying to STM the system 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:10 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: STM? 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah transactional memory 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:27 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape headscratches. 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:31 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: in english? 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:42 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: that is english :D just jargonese :D 
Wed Jun 24 01:57:55 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Marf. 
Wed Jun 24 01:58:23 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: its a method for turning instruction sequences into transactions 
Wed Jun 24 01:58:35 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: which can be nested (usually) 
Wed Jun 24 01:58:46 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: there's a thread on lpmuds.net about it 
Wed Jun 24 01:58:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: which commit or rollback 
Wed Jun 24 01:59:02 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Oh. Procedures? 
Wed Jun 24 01:59:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: depending on if there is interference 
Wed Jun 24 01:59:14 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape ponders PL/SQL and TSQL 
Wed Jun 24 01:59:21 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: with another thread 
Wed Jun 24 01:59:47 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: at least with my non-blocking code, you can have as many, essentially command prompts, going at once 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:06 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: i think? It's been a while. 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:12 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: that wouldn't work. 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:14 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: I guess what I will do is make a simple system then 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:34 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i.e. have the db commit just periodically if data gets written to the outermost nesting 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:40 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: you can have procedures 
Wed Jun 24 02:00:59 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: its just an idea that Hamlet was working on 
Wed Jun 24 02:01:08 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: (STM) that is 
Wed Jun 24 02:02:01 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: I am trying to write some C++ code to to emulate the basic structure 
Wed Jun 24 02:03:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: those are stored procedures right? 
Wed Jun 24 02:03:47 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape nods. 
Wed Jun 24 02:03:49 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: like pl/sql 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: remember writing some of those b4 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:28 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: mysql> CREATE PROCEDURE simpleproc (OUT param1 INT)dchat    -> BEGIN 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:33 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: er, whatever. 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:39 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: mysql> CREATE PROCEDURE simpleproc (OUT param1 INT) 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:46 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape:    -> BEGI 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:54 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape:    ->   SELECT COUNT(*) INTO param1 FROM t; 
Wed Jun 24 02:04:56 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: nod probably might not be what I am looking for- I suspect I just need simple data dumps on a timer 
Wed Jun 24 02:05:01 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape:    -> END// 
Wed Jun 24 02:05:04 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape nods. 
Wed Jun 24 02:05:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and the ability to just grab all the object data at once on startup 
Wed Jun 24 02:05:39 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and quickly write back dirty stuff. 
Wed Jun 24 02:08:11 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: explain this STM stuff please? 
Wed Jun 24 02:08:15 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: my brain is broken. 
Wed Jun 24 02:08:26 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: what are you trying to accomplish with it? 
Wed Jun 24 02:10:53 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: sec letme grab a wiki link 
Wed Jun 24 02:12:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: basically its a technique to get multicore speedups without having the programmer to reason as much about stuff like mutexs/race conditions and deadlocks. 
Wed Jun 24 02:12:44 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: it has also slightly loser constraints 
Wed Jun 24 02:12:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but TBH i am learning as i go 
Wed Jun 24 02:13:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: Hamlet was researching putting it into fluffos 
Wed Jun 24 02:13:13 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: I'd leave it to Hamlet. 
Wed Jun 24 02:13:16 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: he required more vespene gas 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i think doing it for fluffos is quite difficult 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:07 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: SQL has built-in locks and queueing and stuff. 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:22 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: not sure what kind of plan hamlet had in minds 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:45 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: though i know Oracle has allowances for cluster computing 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:50 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but designing the runtime from scratch 
Wed Jun 24 02:14:58 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: makes it "in theory" a bit easier 
Wed Jun 24 02:15:22 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: essentially what it did was queue the transactions up, and return them like it would have been when it was requested 
Wed Jun 24 02:15:24 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: IIRC 
Wed Jun 24 02:15:30 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: I was hoping to talk to hamlet a bit about it I am still not sure how to handle fast commits 
Wed Jun 24 02:15:42 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: (moar vespene) 
Wed Jun 24 02:16:01 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah need hamlet for some STM advice hehe :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:17:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: Crat for Solaris can you specify which processor a thread should run on? 
Wed Jun 24 02:17:24 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: or is it at the process level? 
Wed Jun 24 02:18:04 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: can haz vespene? 
Wed Jun 24 02:18:12 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: hehe 
Wed Jun 24 02:18:23 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont have any :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:18:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you can do all sorts of crazy stuff as root but a process is at the mercy of the sceduler iirc 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:04 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: modern solaris has neat resouce management tricks you can play with 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:08 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im not that familiar with it 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:18 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the answer is "depends, i dont really remember" 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:20 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: k 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:50 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i thought you were going to get a solaris internals book 
Wed Jun 24 02:19:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah working on it 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:01 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: not much use asking for detailed kernel info on intermud 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well i heard you mention it to hamlet 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:22 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so i thought you might know 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:25 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: HAMLAT 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:32 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i luf hamlat he is good 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:38 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: :P 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:44 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: he makes things go 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:46 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: Hamlet is cool :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:20:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:21:14 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i luf peple tha tmake things go 
Wed Jun 24 02:21:18 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i just dont have much use for his many fluffos additions and fixes (since I dont use it) 
Wed Jun 24 02:21:35 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: but his translation thing was purty cool 
Wed Jun 24 02:22:00 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: book is checked on from library so i have to wait 
Wed Jun 24 02:22:26 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: when it comes to driver stuff I am pretty noob 
Wed Jun 24 02:22:32 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so I am just learning 
Wed Jun 24 02:22:37 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: send lars a pm 
Wed Jun 24 02:22:55 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: he will probably just call me a noob :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:23:06 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no he will prolyl just not reply 
Wed Jun 24 02:23:15 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: even worse :( 
Wed Jun 24 02:23:38 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: and if he does he'll be like "lol 17 years ago i knew about a driver that is now outdated, and i dont even remember any of it" 
Wed Jun 24 02:23:57 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: so really i'm not saying pm lars 
Wed Jun 24 02:24:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: im sayin siddown and code somethin alredy 
Wed Jun 24 02:24:24 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: heh what do you think i am trying to do? :D i just dont release alot of stuff :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:24:40 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: k sry 
Wed Jun 24 02:24:45 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: dont mean to be mean 
Wed Jun 24 02:24:49 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: just so low on vespene 
Wed Jun 24 02:25:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i was working on the runtime system yesterday (for the driver) 
Wed Jun 24 02:25:38 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and got figured out how i think to implement the compiler on top of LLVM 2.5 
Wed Jun 24 02:25:51 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: 2with antlers? 
Wed Jun 24 02:25:54 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: so now I just need some details on STM 
Wed Jun 24 02:25:57 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: or luaus? 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:11 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah ANTLR + toy.g 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:19 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: total guess 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:23 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i rok 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:29 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: since the grammar really is just some standard constructs 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:39 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i might redo the grammar later 
Wed Jun 24 02:26:57 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well a lexical analysis algorith will automate the gruntwork 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:02 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ANTLR actually kind of sucks 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:05 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i suggest taking the time coding rules for one 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:07 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: for what i want to do 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:11 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: save you time later 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:33 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: meh. :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:36 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i dont have any idea what i just said 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:41 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: did it sound smart? 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: you are talking nonsense 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:47 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: no :D 
Wed Jun 24 02:27:48 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: :) 
Wed Jun 24 02:33:05 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape grins. 
Wed Jun 24 02:40:53 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: http://www.mudkipz.org/dsp 
Wed Jun 24 02:41:31 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: That looks photoshopped. 
Wed Jun 24 02:41:39 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: supposedly that'll punch through firewalls, etc, and no plugin is required 
Wed Jun 24 02:41:40 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: I can tell from the pixels and from seeing a lot of photoshops in my time. 
Wed Jun 24 02:43:52 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: That's pretty neat. Uh. Does the source IP come through? 
Wed Jun 24 02:44:06 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: no, that's the downside 
Wed Jun 24 02:44:08 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: (the private network in the connecting to... made me wodneR) 
Wed Jun 24 02:44:10 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: ah 
Wed Jun 24 02:44:59 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you can sort of tell, based on the webserver log 
Wed Jun 24 02:45:09 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: an correlating to the enters log 
Wed Jun 24 02:45:24 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: but it's not elegant 
Wed Jun 24 03:02:57 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: binding a thread to a specific processor under linux or windows is relatively easy.  I would assume it wouldn't be that hard under solaris either. 
Wed Jun 24 03:03:34 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well I am a bit of a noob. how do you do it under linux? 
Wed Jun 24 03:04:32 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: I was afraid you'd ask that.  lemmee go search the code out.  I typed it in, verified it worked, and never thought about it again :P 
Wed Jun 24 03:04:45 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: hehe thats ok. I will poke around :D 
Wed Jun 24 03:04:57 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: have a serious STM question tho 
Wed Jun 24 03:05:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: is the correct way to implement STM nested transactions to use patches essentially? 
Wed Jun 24 03:06:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: and what is the pro/cons of doing a word based thingy versus object based one? 
Wed Jun 24 03:07:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: sched_setaffinity() 
Wed Jun 24 03:07:11 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: definitely linux-specific. 
Wed Jun 24 03:07:34 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: thanks :-) 
Wed Jun 24 03:08:00 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: there isn't a posix equivalent? 
Wed Jun 24 03:08:15 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: well this is just a toy system i am working on. 
Wed Jun 24 03:08:26 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: just thinking through and coding the runtime atm 
Wed Jun 24 03:08:53 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: simpler STM systems just flatten nested transations... just have a "number of BEGINs" count.  If any internal transaction aborts, it just rolls back to the first BEGIN.  an END just decrements the count until it gets to 0, at which time the commit occurs.  that's the EASY way, anyway. 
Wed Jun 24 03:09:07 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Hamlet! 
Wed Jun 24 03:09:32 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: for more advanced systems, inner commits just move the variable changes into the next layer up's speculative list. 
Wed Jun 24 03:09:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: aye thats what i am trying to do 
Wed Jun 24 03:09:58 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i am just not sure how to log the changes and efficiently do the merge 
Wed Jun 24 03:10:07 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: obviously, the second way is better.  with the first way, any abort aborts the WHOLE stack, not just the inner transaction. 
Wed Jun 24 03:10:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: which currently is the best algorithm to use? i guess I can pull down a paper 
Wed Jun 24 03:10:48 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: I can't remember right off if there's literature about doing it more or less efficiently. 
Wed Jun 24 03:11:05 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: lemmee think and bug me tomorrow if I haven't sent something :P 
Wed Jun 24 03:11:07 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ok maybe i will just look at some implementations 
Wed Jun 24 03:11:27 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: oh no need :D I just wanted a name or something 
Wed Jun 24 03:11:33 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: Shadyman!? 
Wed Jun 24 03:11:47 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Rar. 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:17 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: Hamlet has 61 letters in his mailbox. Oi. 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:22 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: word-based STMs are a pain in my experience.  very clunky.  object-based ones tend to have much cleaner implementations. 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:36 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ok. 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:42 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: yes, and they're all from, er, 1996. 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:48 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape: heh 
Wed Jun 24 03:12:58 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: guess i will search for some object based papers 
Wed Jun 24 03:15:40 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: TL-2 by shavit good for a basic design? 
Wed Jun 24 03:16:09 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: TL-2 is a hideous pain to use.  Frankly, I've come to the opinion that an STM library (alone) is a bad idea.  Need compiler support. 
Wed Jun 24 03:16:25 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: Intel has an STM compiler (or probably technically a precompiler).  Seems promising, but I haven't gotten around to testing yet. 
Wed Jun 24 03:16:51 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: if you try to use TL-2, you'll be half nuts within an hour. 
Wed Jun 24 03:17:17 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: hmm i was planning to implement the thing myself... 
Wed Jun 24 03:17:35 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: STM_WRITE(STM_READ(&foo), 3) 
Wed Jun 24 03:17:37 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: erg. 
Wed Jun 24 03:17:56 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: I am just sketching out the runtime data layer 
Wed Jun 24 03:19:06 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i guess the problem with a mud system is the data is somewhat heterogeneous i.e. you have in principle with the LLVM system bits of code in memory + object data + program data structures which all need to be rolled back etc. 
Wed Jun 24 03:19:21 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: yeah. 
Wed Jun 24 03:19:41 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: the only system i have looked at so far is the dgd system and I am not sure if I understand it thoroughly. 
Wed Jun 24 03:20:13 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i would love to use an STM precompiler but Intel charges money :( 
Wed Jun 24 03:20:19 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: Solaris seems to be processor_bind(), by the way.  And no POSIX version at all. 
Wed Jun 24 03:20:58 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ok thanks. 
Wed Jun 24 03:21:01 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: yeah, I was trying to figure that out.  if you download the STM one, you can have it free for non-profit use, but it doesn't contain the actual compiler, so you still have to have a trial version of it or whatever. 
Wed Jun 24 03:22:04 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: for a STM library is there something you would recommend? it might save me sometime (if i can get it to do what i want) 
Wed Jun 24 03:22:14 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: seems nice, though.  you just mark _functions_ as STM, and I guess it handles all the variable crap for you.  You just have to mark where to start and where to end. 
Wed Jun 24 03:22:41 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: for a library to be used with C code?  TL2 seems to be about all there is, really. 
Wed Jun 24 03:23:15 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: for original code it might not be all that bad.  trying to modify a large, existing app with it is mind-twistingly unpleasant, though. 
Wed Jun 24 03:23:23 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: i can imagine 
Wed Jun 24 03:24:10 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: can you interface something like TL2 with a GC? 
Wed Jun 24 03:24:19 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: or can they not be used together? 
Wed Jun 24 03:25:20 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: *might* be able to find the British word-based thing... uh.  Maybe something by Tim Harris.  Can't remember for sure. 
Wed Jun 24 03:25:46 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ok thanks for the help! 
Wed Jun 24 03:26:10 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: Well, TL2 has speculative malloc() and free().  So I guess that could be promoted to be useful with GC. 
Wed Jun 24 03:26:29 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: ah ok. 
Wed Jun 24 03:27:20 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: okee.  afk for me! 
Wed Jun 24 03:27:43 2009 [dchat] Silenus@Dead Souls Dev: thanks hamlet 
Wed Jun 24 08:55:26 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev yawns. 
Wed Jun 24 08:55:39 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: sup, Demitris? 
Wed Jun 24 08:56:10 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: trying to find a function to change the mud time 
Wed Jun 24 08:56:41 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: as in the current time, or how the time behaves? 
Wed Jun 24 08:57:03 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: I want to switch between day and night for the whole mud not just using ticktock 
Wed Jun 24 08:57:12 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: for the latter there are files in /cfg , and some code in SEASONS_D... 
Wed Jun 24 08:57:15 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: ahh... 
Wed Jun 24 08:57:19 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: so that I can watch the twilight and noon events happen 
Wed Jun 24 08:57:44 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: See, that's a fun thing... Some time ago somebody patched the seasons daemon so it derives the mud time from the system time somehow. 
Wed Jun 24 08:58:15 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I was going to fix it since, like, forever... don't expect it today, tho ;( 
Wed Jun 24 08:58:32 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: I see 
Wed Jun 24 08:59:13 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: another question I wanted to ask is if virtual rooms are the way to go for making an ocean between continents 
Wed Jun 24 08:59:35 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: I want sailing and npcs over 1000s of "rooms" 
Wed Jun 24 08:59:45 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: IIRC it currently works by taking current system date (eval return time()), subtracting DAY_ONE from it, and mapping it on the daylengs you set 
Wed Jun 24 09:00:15 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: which's usually 20h days with 60 minutes each, with every real second being four mud seconds.. 
Wed Jun 24 09:00:34 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Well, yeah, that'd be virtual work. 
Wed Jun 24 09:00:52 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: is there anywhere I can read about virtual rooms? 
Wed Jun 24 09:01:03 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: With some effort you can make the descriptions vary somewhat randomly or by general sector location, have wather and all such. 
Wed Jun 24 09:01:16 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I'm afraid no. But there are some example virt areas in standard domains. 
Wed Jun 24 09:01:36 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: (if you find some docs about them, i'd like to see it too ;)) 
Wed Jun 24 09:01:57 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: haha 
Wed Jun 24 09:03:12 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Seems that i need to finally install 2.10 and get back to hacking - been quite unproductive during last few months... 
Wed Jun 24 09:03:18 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev yawns. 
Wed Jun 24 09:03:52 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: coding on dead souls is very addictive :P 
Wed Jun 24 09:04:05 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev nods solemnly. 
Wed Jun 24 09:04:07 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: so many possibilities 
Wed Jun 24 09:04:56 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: you have any experience with IBM desktops, by chance? I'm not sure if more modern models can support old-school 45lb CRT on top of the case... 
Wed Jun 24 09:05:44 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: i'm asking everybody i can about it, because i'd prefer not to try... 
Wed Jun 24 09:29:30 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: no idea, sorry 
Wed Jun 24 09:30:43 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Thought so. 
Wed Jun 24 09:31:40 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work though 
Wed Jun 24 09:35:22 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: so what's the advantage of using virtual rooms for large areas? 
Wed Jun 24 09:38:36 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: First, you don't need to create thousands of room files. 
Wed Jun 24 09:39:13 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Second, The creation is more or less automatic, and still can vary and/or load handmade rooms where you want. 
Wed Jun 24 09:39:55 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: sounds great, now to have a look at how they work 
Wed Jun 24 09:40:57 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: (oh, and third, they're more lightweight - may not be important now, but when you get a lot of players loading thousands of rooms...) 
Wed Jun 24 09:41:28 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua nods. 
Wed Jun 24 10:26:27 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Ok, now something completely different. I'm planning to buy a new hard disk. It'd be my first SATA one - that should be a good indicator of how far from recent technologies I am.  I'm looking for something in the 500-750GB range, and i'm much more interested in long-term reliability with average/good performance than extreme performance with MTBF being 2-3 years. 
Wed Jun 24 10:27:09 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: WD "green" AACS/AADS? WD "blue" AAJS/AAKS? Seagate 7200.12? Hitachi? Something else? 
Wed Jun 24 10:27:34 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: I prefer western digital, never had one die on me 
Wed Jun 24 10:27:54 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: i like WDC too. But i heard they had some trouble some time ago? 
Wed Jun 24 10:28:09 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: what kind of trouble? 
Wed Jun 24 10:28:39 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Dunno, general opinion from reading forums. 
Wed Jun 24 10:28:53 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Some time ago == 2+ years, anyway. 
Wed Jun 24 10:29:41 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: i've had half a dozen western digital hard disks and i'm yet to run into any problems 
Wed Jun 24 10:31:13 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Well, same here... but newest one I have is from '02 - a lot could happen in the meantime, that's why i'm asking. 
Wed Jun 24 10:33:36 2009 [dchat] Demitris@Consua: can't go wrong with getting a smaller backup drive 
Wed Jun 24 10:34:23 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Guess i should re-post later... folks are sleeping... 
Wed Jun 24 10:34:25 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev grins stupidly. 
Wed Jun 24 10:37:47 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: I have had disks from any brand fail over time. 
Wed Jun 24 10:38:43 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: That's quite obvious. But how long did they last? 
Wed Jun 24 10:39:03 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: 2 things to keep in mind here. failures are statistially most likely in the first few hundred hours of use, and again when approaching MBF. 
Wed Jun 24 10:39:26 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: And did you heard of any HDeath affairs others than the Seagate 7200.11 one? 
Wed Jun 24 10:39:30 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: second thing, it is  much much easier to produce a disk at approx 2/3 of the current max capacity, and they tend to be much more reliable as a result. 
Wed Jun 24 10:39:57 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I'm looking at 500, maybe 750. MUCH cheaper. 
Wed Jun 24 10:40:05 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: than terabyte stuff. 
Wed Jun 24 10:40:22 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: and it's still a lot of space. 
Wed Jun 24 10:40:28 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: I've had maxtors, samsungs, WDs all fail within 2 years from purchase. 
Wed Jun 24 10:41:09 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: I also have disks from all of those that are still working 10 years after purchase. 
Wed Jun 24 10:41:54 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: ah yes, and a bunch of seagate disks as well, both failures within a few years and disks that don't seem to die ever. 
Wed Jun 24 10:43:24 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: by now I simply regard disks as unreliable components that require redundancy. 
Wed Jun 24 10:45:13 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Redundancy is over my budget, i'm afraid... so are you saying that currently it's mostly preference? 
Wed Jun 24 11:12:13 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: Bleh, I hate making decisions. They lead to responsibility! 
Wed Jun 24 11:53:16 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: sorry, was afk for a bit. What I am saying is that roughly the various brands of disks are equivalent in reliability/price, but all of them have had and will have bad batches at times. 
Wed Jun 24 11:53:44 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: hence, investigate the specific disks you are looking at, looking only at the brand isn't gonna do much. 
Wed Jun 24 12:01:31 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: I'm looking at specific series. WD AAKS ("blue"), WD AACS ("green") and Seagate 7200.12. 
Wed Jun 24 12:07:37 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: well, for all it is worth, I have 2 AAKS (caviar blue) disks in this machine, both have been doing well so far :P 
Wed Jun 24 12:08:22 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: and that's how long? 
Wed Jun 24 12:09:35 2009 [dchat] Aidil@GurbaDev2: good question, lemme see if I can retrieve the installation date. but no more then 2 years yet. 
Wed Jun 24 12:10:04 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: thanks. 
Wed Jun 24 12:13:46 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: hmm, can't find the original installation date, but it has been powered on for 470.5 days total. 
Wed Jun 24 12:14:11 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: btw.. smartmontools ftw. 
Wed Jun 24 12:18:00 2009 [dchat] Aidil@Way of the Force: both disks indicate never having had a read error, but that is likely due to how it reports those since both have had a few dozen calibration retries. No sector replacements yet tho. 
Wed Jun 24 12:25:51 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: WD400JB in here reports one pending sector since 2005... prolly remap would fix it but i just left that cylinder +/- 3 unpartitioned and it's working nicely. no need to mess with it now and risk more damage ;) 
Wed Jun 24 16:26:28 2009 [dchat] Aidil@GurbaDev2: heh. 
Wed Jun 24 18:28:17 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good afternoon 
Wed Jun 24 18:44:22 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: I believe you, Detah! 
Wed Jun 24 18:44:41 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I do not remember. what did I posit? 
Wed Jun 24 18:44:56 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: that it was afternoon, and good. 
Wed Jun 24 19:09:13 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: well!  that's a bit disconcerting.  Expecting a call from the pet sitter, get a call, find yourself talking to a potential employer. 
Wed Jun 24 19:20:46 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: any employment is good. employment here is still falling sharply in almost every sector. 
Wed Jun 24 19:22:56 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I just read today that Harvard cut 275 jobs today, because of declining enrollment. ..... So you know its bad. 
Wed Jun 24 19:23:22 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: ack. typo. -enrollment +endowment. 
Wed Jun 24 19:40:56 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: ew.  it's scary when universities are having to cut back. 
Wed Jun 24 19:41:23 2009 [dchat] Drakkos@Discworld: I don't know, it's usually an excuse to clear out the deadwood. :-P 
Wed Jun 24 19:41:31 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: usually they have more students as unemployment rises... people decide maybe it's time to go back to school.  I guess that would apply to state colleges more than harvard, though. 
Wed Jun 24 19:41:32 2009 [dchat] Drakkos@Discworld: Certainly over here, it's virtually impossible otherwise 
Wed Jun 24 19:42:15 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: yeah.  I worked for Whirlpool Corp for years.  Very few firings.  You practically had to sleep with the boss (and get caught) to get fired.  Otherwise, they just waited for layoffs. 
Wed Jun 24 19:42:33 2009 [dchat] Drakkos@Discworld: If you get fired after sleeping with the boss, I think you're doing it wrong 
Wed Jun 24 19:43:00 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: apparently!  they both got fired.  it was the big boss of the department, too. 
Wed Jun 24 19:55:08 2009 [dchat] Zaknafein@AoD TempMUD: did they get caught on one of the washer models? :D 
Wed Jun 24 20:07:29 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: oooo.  that'd be funny. 
Thu Jun 25 01:33:19 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Haldir Needs to Think About This.: hello 
Thu Jun 25 01:36:18 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: You should think about the full stop in your mud name! 
Thu Jun 25 01:38:02 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i don't know why you say hello, i say goodbye 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:10 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Haldir Needs to Think About This.: the full stop in my mud name? 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:38 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@Discworld: We convert "mud.name.n.stuff" to "mud name n stuff" for the i3 stuff. 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:47 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: Hmm. I like Discworld, particularly Ankh-Morpork, seeing as I haven't left. 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:50 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: All roads lead to ankh-morpork 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:51 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: or away from it... 
Thu Jun 25 01:54:52 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: i forget 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:17 2009 [dchat] Taffyd@Discworld: Ankh-Morpork is a pretty big city. I do recommend you go on a road-trip one day though to the Lancre villages and maybe the Counterweight continent. :) 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:28 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: for some reason I'm putting alot of humor into this game... not quite sure why... 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:29 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it amuses you 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:31 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: seems a good enough reason 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:32 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: Kinda, but usually I'm a serious person 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:33 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: all the more reason, mr grumpy face 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:35 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: Now that's just mean 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:35 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: heh 
Thu Jun 25 01:55:37 2009 [dchat] Ideysus@ShadowMUDii: DW is sapping all my coding time :-( 
Thu Jun 25 04:04:20 2009 [dchat] Tigwyk@LP Heroes: Crat, do you ever re-read through your manuals and chuckle at your humour? ;) 
Thu Jun 25 04:05:18 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i'm pretty awesome 
Thu Jun 25 04:05:36 2009 [dchat] Tigwyk@LP Heroes: I love it, man. Hilarious. 
Thu Jun 25 04:05:39 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@Discworld: and humble! 
Thu Jun 25 04:05:47 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: the humblest 
Thu Jun 25 04:07:32 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: lol 
Thu Jun 25 04:51:56 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: where is the code for the creator's manual? 
Thu Jun 25 04:58:18 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: nevermind, I found it 
Thu Jun 25 04:58:28 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: ..mySELF! 
Thu Jun 25 05:00:10 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: g'night everyone 
Thu Jun 25 05:00:18 2009 [dchat] Tigwyk@LP Heroes: night 
Thu Jun 25 17:04:20 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev yips. 
Thu Jun 25 17:53:49 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: good afternoon 
Thu Jun 25 17:55:34 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: it IS pretty good!  nice weather, the kid is behaving, etc!  Is work good too? 
Thu Jun 25 17:56:07 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I just finished the longest indicators report I have ever written. that really frees up my week. *grin* 
Thu Jun 25 17:56:31 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: heh. 
Thu Jun 25 17:57:07 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: whats everyone working on today? 
Thu Jun 25 17:57:24 2009 [dchat] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: living 
Thu Jun 25 17:57:49 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: had to drive north of Boston and back again :(  for some reason the construction was not symmetric. 
Thu Jun 25 17:58:00 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: much worse on the way back. 
Thu Jun 25 18:18:59 2009 [dchat] Shadyman@QuantumScape dooks like a ferret. 
Thu Jun 25 19:05:15 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: hello 
Thu Jun 25 19:05:28 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: again? 
Thu Jun 25 19:05:39 2009 [dchat] Haldir@Pending: I guess so 
Thu Jun 25 19:13:37 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: don't guess.  know! 
Thu Jun 25 20:36:09 2009 [dchat] Aidil@GurbaDev2 won't 
Thu Jun 25 20:51:27 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: don't guess.  know! 
Thu Jun 25 20:51:31 2009 [dchat] Hamlet@WWC: oops 
Thu Jun 25 20:57:53 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: does anyone know where i can find source for browser based file editor written in lpc? 
Thu Jun 25 20:59:27 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: /www of dead souls distro zip? 
Thu Jun 25 20:59:49 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah dead souls has one, look in /www/cgi 
Thu Jun 25 21:00:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: http://dead-souls.net/ 
Thu Jun 25 21:00:59 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: should download the new but awesome version or the stable? 
Thu Jun 25 21:01:07 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: 2.10 
Thu Jun 25 21:01:09 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: atm they're the same. 
Thu Jun 25 21:02:02 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: it's lib specific, hooked into a daemon or two, but it should be a clue as to how to do it 
Thu Jun 25 21:02:58 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: Cratylus we talked before, im pretty crafty if you recall. 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:03 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: i hope 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:05 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: :) 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:16 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: you play chess? 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:36 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: nice to meet you crafty. Im smart Rubka. 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:40 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: i play some.  i wrote a chess board in lpc 
Thu Jun 25 21:03:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: i drinks a bit 
Thu Jun 25 21:04:01 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: me too 
Thu Jun 25 21:04:20 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: (drink) 
Thu Jun 25 21:04:46 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: do you have your chessboard online somewhere? Id love to see it. 
Thu Jun 25 21:05:08 2009 [dchat] Kalinash@Fire and Ice: the chess is a lie 
Thu Jun 25 21:06:10 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: i do not but i will paste somewhere if you want.  atm there is no rule checking, but you can sit and play against another player, as long as you both observe the rules 
Thu Jun 25 21:06:33 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: That's cooler, allows for cheating ;) 
Thu Jun 25 21:06:39 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: one second and ill paste it 
Thu Jun 25 21:06:53 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: Im curious to see what type of gui interface you use. 
Thu Jun 25 21:07:08 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: er, ascii interface. 
Thu Jun 25 21:14:04 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: http://pastebin.ca/1474628 
Thu Jun 25 21:14:52 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: it was developed on my own lib, you'll need to port it if you want it to work for you. 
Thu Jun 25 21:18:43 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: what is the licensing on that plz 
Thu Jun 25 21:23:22 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: acceptable? 
Thu Jun 25 21:23:54 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: your code, fine by me. thx 
Thu Jun 25 21:28:50 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: is it work for you detah? 
Thu Jun 25 21:29:27 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I just got the pastebin to load. apparantly my whole IP had been blocked for somereason. I had to get my name off the naughty list and reload 5 times to make it work. 
Thu Jun 25 21:30:44 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: are you the author? 
Thu Jun 25 21:32:19 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: the code mentions a "Azhag", is why I ask. 
Thu Jun 25 21:36:27 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: ohh. when you said no rules checking, you meant it. 
Thu Jun 25 21:39:44 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: egad. Kiasyn's MSSP output is like a vanGogh painting. You can tell what it is, but its truely ugly. 
Thu Jun 25 21:46:08 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: the MSSP fields are all just arrays, right? then why not print them in a sensible order? May I suggest Mudname as the first item. I have no idea why ANSI 0/1 is the top item. Is that considered to be the most important thing that players/admin are looking for when scanning this data? 
Thu Jun 25 21:46:52 2009 [dchat] Raudhrskal@Dead Souls Dev: alphabetical sort? 
Thu Jun 25 21:46:54 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: and make better use of sprintf. there is no reason why you need to wrap from row to row. Thats just crazy talk. 
Thu Jun 25 21:47:07 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: sorry about that i lost my internet connection 
Thu Jun 25 21:47:12 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: yes, I am Azhag 
Thu Jun 25 21:47:16 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: thats my character name 
Thu Jun 25 21:47:58 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: AHA, you are right, R.  it is alphabetical by field name. that seems like the worst possible sort order for this type of data. 
Thu Jun 25 21:49:48 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I would think that basic demographic info aboutthe mud would occupy the first 3 or 4 fields. eg. Name, Mudtype, Hostname, IP. 
Thu Jun 25 21:51:38 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: thats some nice-lookin code, Michael. 
Thu Jun 25 21:51:45 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: thank you 
Thu Jun 25 21:51:51 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: it could be better 
Thu Jun 25 21:52:05 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: if you wanna see some nice code you should see the rest of my infant lib. 
Thu Jun 25 21:52:17 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: I can see right now, that adding rules will be/would be extremely complex. 
Thu Jun 25 21:52:30 2009 [dchat] Michael@Citadel Development: aye. 
Thu Jun 25 21:52:46 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well the data spit out by the mud is meant to be digested by an algorithm, not a person 
Thu Jun 25 21:53:00 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: you're not really meant to be readin the raw output 
Thu Jun 25 21:53:34 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: do you mean its being logged into some sort of database? 
Thu Jun 25 21:54:02 2009 [dchat] Sinistrad@Dead Souls Dev: a Detahbase 
Thu Jun 25 21:55:01 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: well yeah 
Thu Jun 25 21:55:06 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: thats the point of mssp 
Thu Jun 25 21:55:26 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: to have the data be slurped up by a crawler that then does the data processing and formatting 
Thu Jun 25 21:56:18 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: fair enough. but for outputting purposes, ie. http://www.kiasyn.com/mssp/, it could have been formated nicer. I always figured this data would be used for manual searchs by potential players. there are several possible ways that data could be serached. If its the raw data for TMC-type mud searches, fine. But for now, with only 10 or so muds, the output should be more eye-friendly. 
Thu Jun 25 21:57:49 2009 [dchat] Aidil@GurbaDev2: well, that is temporary, and, no matter the order, people will argue it should be different :) 
Thu Jun 25 21:58:10 2009 [dchat] Detah@Dead Souls Dev: those escape chars get on my nerves. 
Thu Jun 25 21:58:52 2009 [dchat] Cratylus@Dead Souls Dev: yeah that page is unattractive 
Thu Jun 25 22:00:48 2009 [dchat] Aidil@GurbaDev2: indeed. 
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